2016 Week 2 Carolina Panthers coaches film analysis

Originally posted by TheWooLick:

Originally posted by captveg:

Originally posted by SofaKing:

Originally posted by susweel:
Doesn't see open guys, doesn't throw passes with touch. sounds a lot like the other dude lol he replaced.

ikr? All the off-season talk was about their differences, but on the field their problems are largely the same.

The big difference is in reading the play. Gabbert is far better at his progressions and recognizing defensive coverage. He's also far better moving in the pocket when he doesn't rush things.

Either he stays the same in his inconsistencies or he improves as the season goes on. One thing he hopefully improves on soon is understanding that his pass protection is generally holding up far better than he's been used to. In theory that would help him settle and allow his throws to be more consistent. In theory.

But he always rushes things.

Because Kelly's offense requires the qb to do things quick. This is not the Harbaugh offense.

I watched the play numerous times from this angle to see if I could spot something in his mechanics that would show why he sailed it. Cause he throws the ball high and a little behind. He rushes his feet and the throw. Almost an "eyes wide" type of thing where he saw it and rushed the play before it could disappear. Either way, he should've put some more air under the ball and led him to the outside - more like his TD pass earlier. You gotta hit these throws - they change the game. Here's to hoping he hits em next time:

I agree. It was a 30 yard pass that he tried to rifle in. More air on it and you let your receiver fight for the ball. The timing and trust between our receivers and Gabbert really seems off.

Originally posted by TheWooLick:

Originally posted by captveg:

Originally posted by SofaKing:

Originally posted by susweel:
Doesn't see open guys, doesn't throw passes with touch. sounds a lot like the other dude lol he replaced.

ikr? All the off-season talk was about their differences, but on the field their problems are largely the same.

The big difference is in reading the play. Gabbert is far better at his progressions and recognizing defensive coverage. He's also far better moving in the pocket when he doesn't rush things.

Either he stays the same in his inconsistencies or he improves as the season goes on. One thing he hopefully improves on soon is understanding that his pass protection is generally holding up far better than he's been used to. In theory that would help him settle and allow his throws to be more consistent. In theory.

But he always rushes things.

But the point is: it helps evaluate some of the other guys right now. One thing you have to give Gab credit for in all of this - he's helping out the O-line as well as they are him. He's getting rid of the ball on time on most plays and has been good at moving around in the pocket - he climbs the pocket well most of the time and has been good shifting from side to side to help out his pass pro while staying in a throwing position. So as much as a lot of people say, "but Gab's only been sacked twice and hardly pressured" he deserves some credit on that as well. Against the Rams his time to release averaged around 2.0 seconds whereas CK has consistently been at 2.5-3 his whole career. There were times when Aaron Donald had good rushes going against Beadles but couldn't get home because the ball came out - I'll take a lower completion % if it means less sacks. Sometimes, not having a negative play is a positive play.

Jonny, thl from what I've seen so far, I agree with you guys quite a bit. Got a busy afternoon and night going so I'm still shifting through the footage and watching it in spades, but you guys are right. Watching the game live there looked to be more opportunities for Gabbert to tuck and run but your mind and eyes are so focused on multiple things at once in those circumstances that you don't get the option of slowing it down like on film where you are free to focus on whatever you want too. So far I haven't seen as many tuck and run opportunities as I thought I did at the game.

Also man you guys hit the nail in the coffin on the panthers dline. Aaron Donald might be the best single defensive tackle in the game but as a pair it'd be hard pressed to find a better duo than Short and Star Lotulelei. Jonny you were really spot on with your comparison to the niners dline of a few years ago. Those guys are so good at sustaining blockers from reaching the second level that Davis and Kuechly just get so much freedom to roam.

From what I saw live and what I've seen on the film, my reaction to the coverages have held up. To me the niners did a real good job overall of sticking to their guys but there were some really spot on passes by Cam and some great catches made by his building sized wide receivers that just have such an incredible catch radius. There really wasn't alot of seperation just great execution between the qb and his wide receivers.

So far it's hard to argue with either of your analysis'. When I finish I'll let you guys know if I see anything different.

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Here was another one of those, *groan* plays. One's he's gotta make and if he makes it, it might settle down some of that QB noise - some....maybe...ok, you're right, who am I kidding? He makes this throw we're still gonna have some people crying for Kap...lol

On the same drive as the play shown earlier with Brown running at him - it's nearly the same play, just run slightly differently.


It's a deep levels concept and this time the Panthers are gonna run a cover 3 zone. Has the same sort of routes as the earlier play. You get a hook from the TE with the other TE blocking backside off a PA fake and two routes crossing the middle of the field.



You see McD gets a lot of attention after the PA fake. It also holds some underneath defenders and the middle safety has lost leverage to T. Smith out of the slot.


McD holds the defenders on that side of the field and T. Smith is running across the field.


This time he see's him but misses the throw.


I watched the play numerous times from this angle to see if I could spot something in his mechanics that would show why he sailed it. Cause he throws the ball high and a little behind. He rushes his feet and the throw. Almost an "eyes wide" type of thing where he saw it and rushed the play before it could disappear. Either way, he should've put some more air under the ball and led him to the outside - more like his TD pass earlier. You gotta hit these throws - they change the game. Here's to hoping he hits em next time:

My big take away from 2 games is that his offense has been pretty good at getting guys wide open with opportunities for explosive play. That's something that I'm personally really happy for. I mean we where just a couple of throws away from 325-350 passing yards. Given our passing personnel that's pretty nice.

Here is the first Out route that resulted in an incompletion.
When trying to connect on an Out route, the WR tries to sell the Go route, and as soon as the CB turns his hips upfield, break the route for the Out (Comeback). The QB has to identify if the CB is going to turn his hips upfield. Looking at this presnap alignment, which CB is more likely to turn his hips upfield as the WR runs vertical - the CB lined up over red or yellow?
vs Cover3


Gabbert takes the snap and looks to his right. The CB (red) is flat footed and watching. The other CB (yellow) has his hips turned upfield and is much more vulnerable to a comeback type of route. Gabbert targets Burbridge (red). I don't expect Gabbert to move his eyes to the other side of the field and see the other Out route, I expect him to never even look to his right because the positioning of the CB defeats an Out route.


Such a small window and a dangerous throw with the CB never having to turn upfield because he was giving a huge cushion presnap.

Originally posted by Willisfn4life:
Jonny, thl from what I've seen so far, I agree with you guys quite a bit. Got a busy afternoon and night going so I'm still shifting through the footage and watching it in spades, but you guys are right. Watching the game live there looked to be more opportunities for Gabbert to tuck and run but your mind and eyes are so focused on multiple things at once in those circumstances that you don't get the option of slowing it down like on film where you are free to focus on whatever you want too. So far I haven't seen as many tuck and run opportunities as I thought I did at the game.

Also man you guys hit the nail in the coffin on the panthers dline. Aaron Donald might be the best single defensive tackle in the game but as a pair it'd be hard pressed to find a better duo than Short and Star Lotulelei. Jonny you were really spot on with your comparison to the niners dline of a few years ago. Those guys are so good at sustaining blockers from reaching the second level that Davis and Kuechly just get so much freedom to roam.

From what I saw live and what I've seen on the film, my reaction to the coverages have held up. To me the niners did a real good job overall of sticking to their guys but there were some really spot on passes by Cam and some great catches made by his building sized wide receivers that just have such an incredible catch radius. There really wasn't alot of seperation just great execution between the qb and his wide receivers.

So far it's hard to argue with either of your analysis'. When I finish I'll let you guys know if I see anything different.

looking forward to it!!!

Originally posted by jonnydel:
Here was another one of those, *groan* plays. One's he's gotta make and if he makes it, it might settle down some of that QB noise - some....maybe...ok, you're right, who am I kidding? He makes this throw we're still gonna have some people crying for Kap...lol

On the same drive as the play shown earlier with Brown running at him - it's nearly the same play, just run slightly differently.


It's a deep levels concept and this time the Panthers are gonna run a cover 3 zone. Has the same sort of routes as the earlier play. You get a hook from the TE with the other TE blocking backside off a PA fake and two routes crossing the middle of the field.



You see McD gets a lot of attention after the PA fake. It also holds some underneath defenders and the middle safety has lost leverage to T. Smith out of the slot.


McD holds the defenders on that side of the field and T. Smith is running across the field.


This time he see's him but misses the throw.


I watched the play numerous times from this angle to see if I could spot something in his mechanics that would show why he sailed it. Cause he throws the ball high and a little behind. He rushes his feet and the throw. Almost an "eyes wide" type of thing where he saw it and rushed the play before it could disappear. Either way, he should've put some more air under the ball and led him to the outside - more like his TD pass earlier. You gotta hit these throws - they change the game. Here's to hoping he hits em next time:

I question if Torrey is even open on this play. Had the body position certainly. I only saw the TV coverage on this play. From the point of the possible catch, that looked like good coverage by the defender, contesting Torrey for the ball.

Originally posted by qnnhan7:

Originally posted by TheWooLick:

Originally posted by captveg:

Originally posted by SofaKing:

Originally posted by susweel:

Doesn't see open guys, doesn't throw passes with touch. sounds a lot like the other dude lol he replaced.

ikr? All the off-season talk was about their differences, but on the field their problems are largely the same.

The big difference is in reading the play. Gabbert is far better at his progressions and recognizing defensive coverage. He's also far better moving in the pocket when he doesn't rush things.

Either he stays the same in his inconsistencies or he improves as the season goes on. One thing he hopefully improves on soon is understanding that his pass protection is generally holding up far better than he's been used to. In theory that would help him settle and allow his throws to be more consistent. In theory.

But he always rushes things.

Because Kelly's offense requires the qb to do things quick. This is not the Harbaugh offense.

If he cannot succeed while rushing things and Kelly's offense requires him to rush things does that mean he cannot succeed with Kelly?
I think he is uncomfortable in the pocket and gets rushed and has footwork problems, I think that has been a problem for his entire career.

Originally posted by qnnhan7:
Because Kelly's offense requires the qb to do things quick. This is not the Harbaugh offense.

When it comes to Gabbert rushing things, it's not a function of the offense. This has been a consistent tendency throughout his career. As jonnydel stated, he appears to play scared. Not scared to take a hit, but scared because of his internal clock. The longer he holds onto the ball waiting for a route to develop, or the longer a ball stays in the air, he feels like something bad is going to happen. That's part of the reason why he rushes through his throws and tries to rifle the ball downfield all the time instead of putting proper touch.

Originally posted by qnnhan7:
Because Kelly's offense requires the qb to do things quick. This is not the Harbaugh offense.

Kelly's offense requires the QB to do things quickly AND accurately.

"In this league, you have to be able to throw the football," Kelly, now the 49ers' coach, said then. "Repetitive accuracy is the No. 1 thing we are looking for."

From that point, "repetitive accuracy" became a refrain in Philadelphia. "He said that a thousand times," said NFL Films senior producer Greg Cosell, who closely watched Kelly's tenure with the Eagles.

Kelly has been stressing the importance of "repetitive accuracy" going back to his New Hampshire days.




With the 49ers current QB's, "occasional accuracy" might be a more accurate description of what they bring to the table.

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Originally posted by TheWooLick:

Originally posted by captveg:

Originally posted by SofaKing:

Originally posted by susweel:

Doesn't see open guys, doesn't throw passes with touch. sounds a lot like the other dude lol he replaced.

ikr? All the off-season talk was about their differences, but on the field their problems are largely the same.

The big difference is in reading the play. Gabbert is far better at his progressions and recognizing defensive coverage. He's also far better moving in the pocket when he doesn't rush things.

Either he stays the same in his inconsistencies or he improves as the season goes on. One thing he hopefully improves on soon is understanding that his pass protection is generally holding up far better than he's been used to. In theory that would help him settle and allow his throws to be more consistent. In theory.

But he always rushes things.

But the point is: it helps evaluate some of the other guys right now. One thing you have to give Gab credit for in all of this - he's helping out the O-line as well as they are him. He's getting rid of the ball on time on most plays and has been good at moving around in the pocket - he climbs the pocket well most of the time and has been good shifting from side to side to help out his pass pro while staying in a throwing position. So as much as a lot of people say, "but Gab's only been sacked twice and hardly pressured" he deserves some credit on that as well. Against the Rams his time to release averaged around 2.0 seconds whereas CK has consistently been at 2.5-3 his whole career. There were times when Aaron Donald had good rushes going against Beadles but couldn't get home because the ball came out - I'll take a lower completion % if it means less sacks. Sometimes, not having a negative play is a positive play.

I do like how quickly he gets rid of the ball but he needs to get the ball downfield as well. Getting rid of the ball quickly for the worst yards per completion in the NFL is not going to cut it even if he doesn't get sacked.

I thought Chip Kelly's philosophy made for a terrible TOP in this game and thats a really bad game plan against the Panthers.

D was gassed.

Originally posted by SofaKing:
When it comes to Gabbert rushing things, it's not a function of the offense. This has been a consistent tendency throughout his career. As jonnydel stated, he appears to play scared. Not scared to take a hit, but scared because of his internal clock. The longer he holds onto the ball waiting for a route to develop, or the longer a ball stays in the air, he feels like something bad is going to happen. That's part of the reason why he rushes through his throws and tries to rifle the ball downfield all the time instead of putting proper touch.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
Kelly's offense requires the QB to do things quickly AND accurately.

"In this league, you have to be able to throw the football," Kelly, now the 49ers' coach, said then. "Repetitive accuracy is the No. 1 thing we are looking for."

From that point, "repetitive accuracy" became a refrain in Philadelphia. "He said that a thousand times," said NFL Films senior producer Greg Cosell, who closely watched Kelly's tenure with the Eagles.

Kelly has been stressing the importance of "repetitive accuracy" going back to his New Hampshire days.




With the 49ers current QB's, "occasional accuracy" might be a more accurate description of what they bring to the table.

I don't disagree. He needs more trust in the line and accuracy going forward. My point is he has to do things at a certain quickness because those routes don't stay open for long. A lot of correct timing to make that work.

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Originally posted by TheWooLick:

Originally posted by captveg:

Originally posted by SofaKing:

Originally posted by susweel:
Doesn't see open guys, doesn't throw passes with touch. sounds a lot like the other dude lol he replaced.

ikr? All the off-season talk was about their differences, but on the field their problems are largely the same.

The big difference is in reading the play. Gabbert is far better at his progressions and recognizing defensive coverage. He's also far better moving in the pocket when he doesn't rush things.

Either he stays the same in his inconsistencies or he improves as the season goes on. One thing he hopefully improves on soon is understanding that his pass protection is generally holding up far better than he's been used to. In theory that would help him settle and allow his throws to be more consistent. In theory.

But he always rushes things.

But the point is: it helps evaluate some of the other guys right now. One thing you have to give Gab credit for in all of this - he's helping out the O-line as well as they are him. He's getting rid of the ball on time on most plays and has been good at moving around in the pocket - he climbs the pocket well most of the time and has been good shifting from side to side to help out his pass pro while staying in a throwing position. So as much as a lot of people say, "but Gab's only been sacked twice and hardly pressured" he deserves some credit on that as well. Against the Rams his time to release averaged around 2.0 seconds whereas CK has consistently been at 2.5-3 his whole career. There were times when Aaron Donald had good rushes going against Beadles but couldn't get home because the ball came out - I'll take a lower completion % if it means less sacks. Sometimes, not having a negative play is a positive play.

Yes! Exactly, for all his faults Gabbert is a big reason there have only been 2 sacks this year. I saw that in the Rams game too. There were a hand full of times were the o-line was beaten quickly and if Gabbert had waited a quarter of a second later to throw, it would have been a sack.

We gave Kap half a season last year to see if he could improve lets at least give Gabbert the same this year. Last year Kap was hesitant on throwing to open receivers and often threw late causing bad things to happen. At least Gabberts throws are on time. Hopefully he can improve his accuracy now.