49ers Head Coach Kyle Shanahan Thread

Originally posted by Joecool:
I hope Kyle has figured out how his offense was literally shut down for a quarter and a half by the Patriots. Although, Kyle is very tactical, his offense hasn't exactly been magical before last season. I've always been skeptical about offenses that heavily rely upon playaction (Kyle's and other very old school offenses) as opposed to those that rely heavily upon matchups (Walsh and Belacheat). Coaches who know how to set up and expose matchups are the ones whose offenses can excel in any game. Coaches who heavily rely on deception and PA eventually get figured out and the opponent stops getting fooled, which was what happened in the Super Bowl.

How about you give credit to NE? they gave up 15.6 pts per game last yr (#1 in the league). IF you told me you got 28 pts on NE, I'd say that's a good thing

That ATL D gave up 570 yards that game lol. Injuries, penalties, and turnovers killed that offense IMHO.

I mean as far as "magical" when he was the OC in Houston (2008-2009) 3rd overall offense and 4th overall offense. He improved a s**tty DC offense from 22nd to 18th in 2010 then16th in 2011...by 2012 they were the 5th overall offense.....they remanded top 10 in 2013 (9th overall) despite all the messes going on in DC as well.

Dude is on point as far as a OC goes. He's got more than play-action going on LOL.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Joecool:
I hope Kyle has figured out how his offense was literally shut down for a quarter and a half by the Patriots. Although, Kyle is very tactical, his offense hasn't exactly been magical before last season. I've always been skeptical about offenses that heavily rely upon playaction (Kyle's and other very old school offenses) as opposed to those that rely heavily upon matchups (Walsh and Belacheat). Coaches who know how to set up and expose matchups are the ones whose offenses can excel in any game. Coaches who heavily rely on deception and PA eventually get figured out and the opponent stops getting fooled, which was what happened in the Super Bowl.

That's a tad bit misguided. It wasn't the X's and O's that lost that game...it was a critical injury to Freeman which Bellicheat exposed. Once their 3rd down back had to play every down and pass protect, they were screwed. They keyed in on him. He got virtually no yards rushing putting them in long yardage and blitzed at him forcing the fumble. And then penalties piled on big time putting themselves in predictable situations.

When Kyle said he rewatched the tape to review his own play calling, he wouldn't change anything...I believe him.

Key injury at a critical time, inexperienced player, penalties, turnovers, etc.

Kudos to Bellicheat for immediately seeing a weakness and attacking it.

So you are telling me because one player went out and it wasn't even their best offensive player, that ruined Kyle's offense? He had Julio Jones and Matt Ryan. They were two of the best 3 players in that game. A simple defense to Kyle's offense would be to run blitz and pursuit hard on the quick checkdowns. That's why he has a tough time with SEA defense because they rush and their secondary plays downhill. Run blitzing takes the foundation away from that offense which is running and shortening the play action and time for the QB to turn around and make a throw which mostly leads to checkdowns.

I don't know, can't rely on a RB who barely got 1000 yards to make or break your offense when you have Matt Ryan, Sanu, Gabriel, and Julio Jones. I'm just saying, Kyle's offense won't be much whenever he doesn't have a run-game.

choked in the superbowl. cant believe we signed him still.

Originally posted by Joecool:

So you are telling me because one player went out and it wasn't even their best offensive player, that ruined Kyle's offense? He had Julio Jones and Matt Ryan. They were two of the best 3 players in that game. A simple defense to Kyle's offense would be to run blitz and pursuit hard on the quick checkdowns. That's why he has a tough time with SEA defense because they rush and their secondary plays downhill. Run blitzing takes the foundation away from that offense which is running and shortening the play action and time for the QB to turn around and make a throw which mostly leads to checkdowns.

I don't know, can't rely on a RB who barely got 1000 yards to make or break your offense when you have Matt Ryan, Sanu, Gabriel, and Julio Jones. I'm just saying, Kyle's offense won't be much whenever he doesn't have a run-game.

I think you're kind of missing the point here. I'd recommend, like I did, going back and watching the second half and watch what happens when Coleman goes out and the series of events after that including execution.

Originally posted by defenderDX:

choked in the superbowl. cant believe we signed him still.

LOL. Just like Harbaugh...glad we got rid of him.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by defenderDX:
choked in the superbowl. cant believe we signed him still.

LOL. Just like Harbaugh...glad we got rid of him.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

How about you give credit to NE? they gave up 15.6 pts per game last yr (#1 in the league). IF you told me you got 28 pts on NE, I'd say that's a good thing

That ATL D gave up 570 yards that game lol. Injuries, penalties, and turnovers killed that offense IMHO.

I mean as far as "magical" when he was the OC in Houston (2008-2009) 3rd overall offense and 4th overall offense. He improved a s**tty DC offense from 22nd to 18th in 2010 then16th in 2011...by 2012 they were the 5th overall offense.....they remanded top 10 in 2013 (9th overall) despite all the messes going on in DC as well.

Dude is on point as far as a OC goes. He's got more than play-action going on LOL.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by Joecool:

I hope Kyle has figured out how his offense was literally shut down for a quarter and a half by the Patriots. Although, Kyle is very tactical, his offense hasn't exactly been magical before last season. I've always been skeptical about offenses that heavily rely upon playaction (Kyle's and other very old school offenses) as opposed to those that rely heavily upon matchups (Walsh and Belacheat). Coaches who know how to set up and expose matchups are the ones whose offenses can excel in any game. Coaches who heavily rely on deception and PA eventually get figured out and the opponent stops getting fooled, which was what happened in the Super Bowl.

How about you give credit to NE? they gave up 15.6 pts per game last yr (#1 in the league). IF you told me you got 28 pts on NE, I'd say that's a good thing

That ATL D gave up 570 yards that game lol. Injuries, penalties, and turnovers killed that offense IMHO.

I mean as far as "magical" when he was the OC in Houston (2008-2009) 3rd overall offense and 4th overall offense. He improved a s**tty DC offense from 22nd to 18th in 2010 then16th in 2011...by 2012 they were the 5th overall offense.....they remanded top 10 in 2013 (9th overall) despite all the messes going on in DC as well.

Dude is on point as far as a OC goes. He's got more than play-action going on LOL.

This. Kyle has proven that he can develop steady offenses. He's been top five everywhere he's been except the one season he was in Cleveland. Just like any coordinator though, Kyle has shown the better players you give him, the more he can do with the offense.

This is a point I have been b***hing about for ages now...piss poor production on first downs. It drove me nuts. We were the equivalent of a baseball team taking the first pitch strike every single time giving you only two more strikes after that.

The title alone gives me a and is huge reason why I loved the Shanahan hire.

The key to Kyle Shanahan's offense: Win on first

http://www.49erswebzone.com/commentary/1696-key-kyle-shanahans-offense-win-first-down

Welcome back WCO!

The answer lies in the misconception that the 2016 Falcons were a run-first team, and their running game set up their passing game. The Falcons were actually a pass-first team, and their passing game set up their running game. Shanahan's passing game was so effective -- and explosive -- because he passed when defenses least expected it -- on first down, and out of heavy sets.

You've heard the old adage that third down is the most important down in football. Technically, this statement is true, in that third down is generally a team's last opportunity to move the chains, and therefore has the greatest effect on a team's Expected Points. Some in the football analytics world argue that first down is the most important down, because success on early downs drastically affects the team's ability to achieve a first down on subsequent downs. Kyle Shanahan's offense expands upon this argument -- if you move the chains on every first down play, you never have to worry about third downs.

I'm so happy I can

PS: Excellent read. Sounds like we'll be leaning on the TE/FB/RB's heavily...lots of heavy personnel packages too.

Shanahan called a terrible game in the second half of the SB. He choked as hqard as a coordinator can choke in a SB and it cost the Falcons the game. It was one game and I have never been a believer in the notion that some good coaches just can't win the big one. I am sure KS learned from his mistakes and will not make them again.

Originally posted by NCommand:

This is a point I have been b***hing about for ages now...piss poor production on first downs. It drove me nuts. We were the equivalent of a baseball team taking the first pitch strike every single time giving you only two more strikes after that.

The title alone gives me a and is huge reason why I loved the Shanahan hire.

The key to Kyle Shanahan's offense: Win on first

http://www.49erswebzone.com/commentary/1696-key-kyle-shanahans-offense-win-first-down

Welcome back WCO!

The answer lies in the misconception that the 2016 Falcons were a run-first team, and their running game set up their passing game. The Falcons were actually a pass-first team, and their passing game set up their running game. Shanahan's passing game was so effective -- and explosive -- because he passed when defenses least expected it -- on first down, and out of heavy sets.

You've heard the old adage that third down is the most important down in football. Technically, this statement is true, in that third down is generally a team's last opportunity to move the chains, and therefore has the greatest effect on a team's Expected Points. Some in the football analytics world argue that first down is the most important down, because success on early downs drastically affects the team's ability to achieve a first down on subsequent downs. Kyle Shanahan's offense expands upon this argument -- if you move the chains on every first down play, you never have to worry about third downs.

I'm so happy I can

PS: Excellent read. Sounds like we'll be leaning on the TE/FB/RB's heavily...lots of heavy personnel packages too.

I didn't know people thought the falcons were a run first team. Their pass/Rush ratio last year was 58/42.

Originally posted by Niners816:

I didn't know people thought the falcons were a run first team. Their pass/Rush ratio last year was 58/42.

Yeah, like how our media here focused on the run game to set up play action, hence why fans not only think he ran a lot but a lot on first downs...my guess.

^

Kind of like fans like Woo who think Kyle called a poor 2nd half of the Superbowl. Woo

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Niners816:

I didn't know people thought the falcons were a run first team. Their pass/Rush ratio last year was 58/42.

Yeah, like how our media here focused on the run game to set up play action, hence why fans not only think he ran a lot but a lot on first downs...my guess.

^

Kind of like fans like Woo who think Kyle called a poor 2nd half of the Superbowl. Woo

Yeah it's true that a good run game with help the effectiveness of the play pass but it's not necessary to be run first in order to playaction.

Originally posted by NCommand:

This is a point I have been b***hing about for ages now...piss poor production on first downs. It drove me nuts. We were the equivalent of a baseball team taking the first pitch strike every single time giving you only two more strikes after that.

The title alone gives me a and is huge reason why I loved the Shanahan hire.

The key to Kyle Shanahan's offense: Win on first

http://www.49erswebzone.com/commentary/1696-key-kyle-shanahans-offense-win-first-down

Welcome back WCO!

The answer lies in the misconception that the 2016 Falcons were a run-first team, and their running game set up their passing game. The Falcons were actually a pass-first team, and their passing game set up their running game. Shanahan's passing game was so effective -- and explosive -- because he passed when defenses least expected it -- on first down, and out of heavy sets.

You've heard the old adage that third down is the most important down in football. Technically, this statement is true, in that third down is generally a team's last opportunity to move the chains, and therefore has the greatest effect on a team's Expected Points. Some in the football analytics world argue that first down is the most important down, because success on early downs drastically affects the team's ability to achieve a first down on subsequent downs. Kyle Shanahan's offense expands upon this argument -- if you move the chains on every first down play, you never have to worry about third downs.

I'm so happy I can

PS: Excellent read. Sounds like we'll be leaning on the TE/FB/RB's heavily...lots of heavy personnel packages too.

Always looked at it as for 3 downs, you need 3 1/3 yards avg to make the first. You get 1-2 yards on 1st down, now you're playing catchup. You get 5 yards, and now your playbook opens up and defense has to cover both run and pass.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Niners816:

I didn't know people thought the falcons were a run first team. Their pass/Rush ratio last year was 58/42.

Yeah, like how our media here focused on the run game to set up play action, hence why fans not only think he ran a lot but a lot on first downs...my guess.

^

Kind of like fans like Woo who think Kyle called a poor 2nd half of the Superbowl. Woo

Does anyone disagree that his play calling was anything other than atrocious in the second half? People blame Roman for calling a few passes at the goal line, Kyle did that the whole second half when all he had to do was burn clock. He didn't burn clock and he didn't score.

Running back Devonta Freeman averaged 6.8 yards per carry in the game, and was virtually ignored when the Falcons needed him most.

— At 28-12, on third-and-1, Matt Ryan dropped back to pass and was sacked by Dont'a Hightower. The Patriots recovered at the Falcons' 25 yard line with 8:30 minutes left.

— After the Patriots cut the lead to 28-20, the Falcons moved it to the Patriots' 25 on a brilliant Julio Jones catch. Shanahan called passing plays on three of the next four snaps, which included a sack and a holding penalty that pushed Atlanta out of Matt Bryant's field-goal range.

I was yelling at the TV. He refused to run the clock out or run the ball at all. It made no sense.

He is a smart guy and a good OC and I am glad to have him but he is the #1 reason the Falcons lost the SB.