49ers Head Coach Kyle Shanahan Thread

Originally posted by Hysterikal:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Hoovtrain:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by NCommand:
Totally. Kyle was just one aspect of that loss to go with my grocery long list of reasons. I don't weigh one aspect heavier than any other because one play most likely means we win that game. We were up 2 scores in the 4Q and lost by 3. That means whether it was Kyle, Garoppolo, Tartt, CB, ST, OL, etc. as a reason we lost, we were right there, and like with the Superbowl, were actually playing better than our opponents until the momentum shifted on the other team making a play late in the game...and that's where this entire team collapses. Under that momentum swing/pressure.

That culture probably won't change with just a QB change either.

Like you said, the best you can hope for is that Kyle "does his job" by learning from his last 3 attempts at winning a Superbowl and that his play makers finally, make that play when it's needed most.

No one buys that for a second.

Are you two trying to imply I weigh the OL most?

LMAO.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
Marc Adams has a nice editorial above on HC and 9ers. Mainly tho, it is about KS. Essentially it is what probably every poster has thot or said at one time or another …and that is playcalling in the 4th Qtr of season ending games, esp with a double digit lead.. He never said "too conservative" but he sure mentioned more than once, that our money guys, (in NFCCG) both Deebo and Kittle got the ball only 4 of 15 plays, and esp near end of game.

In SB game couple yrs back, it was again, our RBs didn't get but a couple chances to handle the ball near end of game.When i re-watched both games, it just looked ultra CONSERVATIVE. Before I looked back, that is exactly what i recalled….the best playcaller in the league going south on playcalllng and basically giving both games away. Kyle is a way better playcaller than he showed at end of both those games, and as much as i like the guy, no question, he got real conservative towards the end, almost beginning at start of 4th qtr.

That's no news to most , but it is one thing that Kyle has got to improve upon. Killer instinct if ahead near end of game. Used to be we called that "Playing not to lose"….errr…and now….well, we still call it that..

poor guy has a lot of his plate this yr, starting with being hands on on all O coaching, in that every coach seems to be new. That's a tall order for a HC, but that is one thing kyle MUST DO. After that, he needs to be working on E O G (end of game) plans as we get nearer to playoffs and then once in playoffs…same thing. E O G planning.

Adams did say that one thing kyle needs to do is get the ball into the hands of our playmakers. Kittle…Deebo…Aiyuk,…probably Jennings…and we''ll see about our two new guys, our new RB and Ray Ray. But no question kyle has got to get better in big game finales. And the further the season goes along, the more that matters. In the championship game, we had the Rams handled and then in 4th qtr, they just dominated us….better playcalls by Rams, esp on D….and on O…he just threw the ball to Kupp. We had no answer for either.

it's' nothing new but is a reminder of what KS has got to do better at this yr. If he is going to be HC here for next 10-15 yrs, then he will have to get better at E O G.

Yeah, good article on the choke artist that is our beloved Kyle Shanahan. Haha.

Ironically, what got us there (running) was what he either stopped doing or we weren't successful in when we needed to close out games. That would be the equivalent of the Rams not being able to pass when needed most.

But nobody focuses on that here.

Personally, I'd like a coach that chokes in championship or Lombardi games, versus choking just trying to make the playoffs. I remember Mooch choking in the playoffs, and he never even smelled as much of the NFCCG versus Kyle. If my coach is going to choke, I'd like him to choke in games that make NFL history. Having said that, I think Kyle's going to have to learn somehow to get over that championship hurdle, and I think he's doing a lot about that. Possibly changing the mixture of the run game to more of power game, and having a QB that has the ability to come back from 14+ point deficits in the last moments of the game -- are just some things he's changing up to get there. Hope hope!

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Hoovtrain:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by NCommand:
Totally. Kyle was just one aspect of that loss to go with my grocery long list of reasons. I don't weigh one aspect heavier than any other because one play most likely means we win that game. We were up 2 scores in the 4Q and lost by 3. That means whether it was Kyle, Garoppolo, Tartt, CB, ST, OL, etc. as a reason we lost, we were right there, and like with the Superbowl, were actually playing better than our opponents until the momentum shifted on the other team making a play late in the game...and that's where this entire team collapses. Under that momentum swing/pressure.

That culture probably won't change with just a QB change either.

Like you said, the best you can hope for is that Kyle "does his job" by learning from his last 3 attempts at winning a Superbowl and that his play makers finally, make that play when it's needed most.

No one buys that for a second.

Are you two trying to imply I weigh the OL most?

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
Marc Adams has a nice editorial above on HC and 9ers. Mainly tho, it is about KS. Essentially it is what probably every poster has thot or said at one time or another …and that is playcalling in the 4th Qtr of season ending games, esp with a double digit lead.. He never said "too conservative" but he sure mentioned more than once, that our money guys, (in NFCCG) both Deebo and Kittle got the ball only 4 of 15 plays, and esp near end of game.

In SB game couple yrs back, it was again, our RBs didn't get but a couple chances to handle the ball near end of game.When i re-watched both games, it just looked ultra CONSERVATIVE. Before I looked back, that is exactly what i recalled….the best playcaller in the league going south on playcalllng and basically giving both games away. Kyle is a way better playcaller than he showed at end of both those games, and as much as i like the guy, no question, he got real conservative towards the end, almost beginning at start of 4th qtr.

That's no news to most , but it is one thing that Kyle has got to improve upon. Killer instinct if ahead near end of game. Used to be we called that "Playing not to lose"….errr…and now….well, we still call it that..

poor guy has a lot of his plate this yr, starting with being hands on on all O coaching, in that every coach seems to be new. That's a tall order for a HC, but that is one thing kyle MUST DO. After that, he needs to be working on E O G (end of game) plans as we get nearer to playoffs and then once in playoffs…same thing. E O G planning.

Adams did say that one thing kyle needs to do is get the ball into the hands of our playmakers. Kittle…Deebo…Aiyuk,…probably Jennings…and we''ll see about our two new guys, our new RB and Ray Ray. But no question kyle has got to get better in big game finales. And the further the season goes along, the more that matters. In the championship game, we had the Rams handled and then in 4th qtr, they just dominated us….better playcalls by Rams, esp on D….and on O…he just threw the ball to Kupp. We had no answer for either.

it's' nothing new but is a reminder of what KS has got to do better at this yr. If he is going to be HC here for next 10-15 yrs, then he will have to get better at E O G.

Yeah, good article on the choke artist that is our beloved Kyle Shanahan. Haha.

Ironically, what got us there (running) was what he either stopped doing or we weren't successful in when we needed to close out games. That would be the equivalent of the Rams not being able to pass when needed most.

But nobody focuses on that here.

Personally, I'd like a coach that chokes in championship or Lombardi games, versus choking just trying to make the playoffs. I remember Mooch choking in the playoffs, and he never even smelled as much of the NFCCG versus Kyle. If my coach is going to choke, I'd like him to choke in games that make NFL history. Having said that, I think Kyle's going to have to learn somehow to get over that championship hurdle, and I think he's doing a lot about that. Possibly changing the mixture of the run game to more of power game, and having a QB that has the ability to come back from 14+ point deficits in the last moments of the game -- are just some things he's changing up to get there. Hope hope!

Definitely. I love me some Kyle Shanahan...just recognizing he's still working through it like everyone else. He'll get there!

Originally posted by Hoovtrain:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Hoovtrain:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by NCommand:
Totally. Kyle was just one aspect of that loss to go with my grocery long list of reasons. I don't weigh one aspect heavier than any other because one play most likely means we win that game. We were up 2 scores in the 4Q and lost by 3. That means whether it was Kyle, Garoppolo, Tartt, CB, ST, OL, etc. as a reason we lost, we were right there, and like with the Superbowl, were actually playing better than our opponents until the momentum shifted on the other team making a play late in the game...and that's where this entire team collapses. Under that momentum swing/pressure.

That culture probably won't change with just a QB change either.

Like you said, the best you can hope for is that Kyle "does his job" by learning from his last 3 attempts at winning a Superbowl and that his play makers finally, make that play when it's needed most.

No one buys that for a second.

Are you two trying to imply I weigh the OL most?

Haha. I can't imagine why you'd tip that way.

Bellicheat is copying Kyle's offense!

Although it's usually the younger coaches picking Belichick's brain, the smoke signals around OTAs this spring suggest that the Patriots' offense is borrowing from the Shanahan tree.
[...]
Based on spring practices, the Pats could be jumping on the Shanahan-style offensive revolution to get the most out of its personnel. But what exactly does that mean?

The foundation for the Shanahan system is built around outside-zone blocking schemes. In outside zone, blockers along the line of scrimmage step at a 90-degree angle towards the sideline and flow horizontally to stretch the defense. The idea is to set up three reads for the running back: bounce (outside), "bang" (in the C-Gap), or cutback across the formation.

The horizontal action creates huge rushing lanes for ball carriers by stretching out the defense and forcing defenders to play in space, leading to explosive runs. There are then motion elements (jet motion), misdirection designs, and other tricks to confuse defenses and get the ball to dangerous playmakers on the move.
[...]
After selecting the two fastest players at their positions in the draft in Thornton (4.28s 40) and Strong (4.37s 40), Director of Player Personnel Matt Groh made a point to emphasize that the onus is now on the coaching staff to create opportunities for players to use their speed.

"These guys wake up every morning, and they're fast. It's a great gift I was never fortunate enough to have. But we're going to try and put them in the best position to use that speed and open things up for us," Groh told reporters following the 2022 NFL Draft.

The Shanahan-style concepts are becoming an industry standard at both the college and pro level, making for easier transitions into the Pats' offense for newly acquired vets and rookie receivers. By most accounts, the passing concepts are much easier to execute for receivers since there are fewer true option routes, and the designs clearly define the post-snap reads.
https://www.clnsmedia.com/patriots-mailbag-what-would-transition-to-shanahan-style-offense-look-like-for-patriots/

Originally posted by Giedi:
Bellicheat is copying Kyle's offense!

Although it's usually the younger coaches picking Belichick's brain, the smoke signals around OTAs this spring suggest that the Patriots' offense is borrowing from the Shanahan tree.
[...]
Based on spring practices, the Pats could be jumping on the Shanahan-style offensive revolution to get the most out of its personnel. But what exactly does that mean?

The foundation for the Shanahan system is built around outside-zone blocking schemes. In outside zone, blockers along the line of scrimmage step at a 90-degree angle towards the sideline and flow horizontally to stretch the defense. The idea is to set up three reads for the running back: bounce (outside), "bang" (in the C-Gap), or cutback across the formation.

The horizontal action creates huge rushing lanes for ball carriers by stretching out the defense and forcing defenders to play in space, leading to explosive runs. There are then motion elements (jet motion), misdirection designs, and other tricks to confuse defenses and get the ball to dangerous playmakers on the move.
[...]
After selecting the two fastest players at their positions in the draft in Thornton (4.28s 40) and Strong (4.37s 40), Director of Player Personnel Matt Groh made a point to emphasize that the onus is now on the coaching staff to create opportunities for players to use their speed.

"These guys wake up every morning, and they're fast. It's a great gift I was never fortunate enough to have. But we're going to try and put them in the best position to use that speed and open things up for us," Groh told reporters following the 2022 NFL Draft.

The Shanahan-style concepts are becoming an industry standard at both the college and pro level, making for easier transitions into the Pats' offense for newly acquired vets and rookie receivers. By most accounts, the passing concepts are much easier to execute for receivers since there are fewer true option routes, and the designs clearly define the post-snap reads.
https://www.clnsmedia.com/patriots-mailbag-what-would-transition-to-shanahan-style-offense-look-like-for-patriots/

Nice crack research as always, Giedi. The bold...we certainly see that here.

Marc Adams spurred a lot of thot provoking controversy with his editorial, and it IS something most of us have thot about…a lot

I am dead serious in hoping Kyle (and JL) stay here for the next 10-15 yrs, which is something only accomplished by NE and Pitts HCs. I admire kyle enough that i hope he ends up in that category…ie, long term HC for the 49ers.

Fingers have been pointed at QB play (jimmy had had jammed finger for awhile), Trent was injured and in retrospectoscope, really shouldn't have played (but would McKivitz or Jay Moore played any better, esp in NFCCG?), remainder of OL were nicked, but really fell out of bed in 4th qtr , putting all kinds of pressure on JimmyG, Kyle's playcalling in E O G (end of game) 4th qtr fell off dramatically….and so on.

maybe the one thing that stood out most was the inability to get a yard, two yards when we had to have them. To that end, one needs look no further than our last draft/FA/trade/UDFA talent acquisitions. Granted, we were picking OLs in 6th, 7th rd, but also JL was working the UDFA OLs, mining for talent , altho perhaps a bit unpolished. What he and kyle came up with looked really odd for a week, couple weeks, and unlike Giedi, i didn't get it early on.

But what was in play was acquisition of man// power blocking OLs, (who will have to learn ZBS instead of acquiring ZBS OLs who would have to learn man/power blocking). That was what looked different. It was, almost surely , a concession by kyle that we have to have gutty OLs who can man/power block for that last few yards we HAVE to HAVE late in game on 3rd and short or inside the 5 yd line on 2nd or 3rd downs. Also, we'll have to wait and see but my guess is he carries 10 OLs this yr, recognizing you have to have really good talent behind your OL starters or your OL will get smoked in playoffs/SB if one or more is injured.

An additional result of better OLs is allowing our all pro TE, #85 , to be able to be a go-to receiver instead of having to help OL block. That was obvious but needed.

In effect , it is recognition that we have not had man/power blocking (except for Trent ..and he gutted it out on one leg and probably shouldn't have been playing )…and we, in fact , have to have it. Another major change was to roll the dice a yr earlier and bring in a different talented QB….this was really great decision by john and kyle LAST yr when they had already looked ahead at what was NOT going to be available at QB THIS yr. Terrific move.

Lastly kyle/JL made two other key moves and those were :

1.drafting bigger , faster , meaner, power backs
2. Again trying to find that one super WR (Kupp- like)…neither will be Kupp, but we do have two new candidates for go-to WRs.

Whether we succeeded or not, we'll find out in next couple months. But QB, OL, bigger power backs, and still that elusive ultra super WR to add to our already excellent stable Deebo/ Aiyuk/ jennings have all been traded/drafted/FAed//UDFAed to fix all those things. As an aside, our woeful DBs…again, vastly upgraded. And out of nowhere we got Drake, something most of us didn't see coming. Well, nobody did because he should have been gone long before we picked at #61.

End result is, whatever we were missing in SB and then again last yr in NFCCG…it looks like kyle and JL have finally gotten the talent they need (altho none of these new adds have proved one thing yet) . We all know Kyle has been thinking about what else he could do to win it all….and looking at the above additions, it sure seems he and JL have put us in position to win it all this yr.

Will it all come together and we win it all this yr? Who knows. Maybe it will take a yr to get all parts integrated and it happens next yr. But JL/KS have done a masterful job of recognizing where we HAD to get better, and for now , anyway, it looks like they were successful.

And i still like Kyle to be our HC for the next 10-15 yrs…and hope JL stays that long also. Also, maybe those "decisions" Kyle made that didn't work in
E O G situations were due to not having the talent needed in slots noted above. Maybe it was talent Kyle needed…and not his decisions that got us beat.

Just a thot.

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
Marc Adams spurred a lot of thot provoking controversy with his editorial, and it IS something most of us have thot about…a lot

I am dead serious in hoping Kyle (and JL) stay here for the next 10-15 yrs, which is something only accomplished by NE and Pitts HCs. I admire kyle enough that i hope he ends up in that category…ie, long term HC for the 49ers.

Fingers have been pointed at QB play (jimmy had had jammed finger for awhile), Trent was injured and in retrospectoscope, really shouldn't have played (but would McKivitz or Jay Moore played any better, esp in NFCCG?), remainder of OL were nicked, but really fell out of bed in 4th qtr , putting all kinds of pressure on JimmyG, Kyle's playcalling in E O G (end of game) 4th qtr fell off dramatically….and so on.

maybe the one thing that stood out most was the inability to get a yard, two yards when we had to have them. To that end, one needs look no further than our last draft/FA/trade/UDFA talent acquisitions. Granted, we were picking OLs in 6th, 7th rd, but also JL was working the UDFA OLs, mining for talent , altho perhaps a bit unpolished. What he and kyle came up with looked really odd for a week, couple weeks, and unlike Giedi, i didn't get it early on.

But what was in play was acquisition of man// power blocking OLs, (who will have to learn ZBS instead of acquiring ZBS OLs who would have to learn man/power blocking). That was what looked different. It was, almost surely , a concession by kyle that we have to have gutty OLs who can man/power block for that last few yards we HAVE to HAVE late in game on 3rd and short or inside the 5 yd line on 2nd or 3rd downs. Also, we'll have to wait and see but my guess is he carries 10 OLs this yr, recognizing you have to have really good talent behind your OL starters or your OL will get smoked in playoffs/SB if one or more is injured.

An additional result of better OLs is allowing our all pro TE, #85 , to be able to be a go-to receiver instead of having to help OL block. That was obvious but needed.

In effect , it is recognition that we have not had man/power blocking (except for Trent ..and he gutted it out on one leg and probably shouldn't have been playing )…and we, in fact , have to have it. Another major change was to roll the dice a yr earlier and bring in a different talented QB….this was really great decision by john and kyle LAST yr when they had already looked ahead at what was NOT going to be available at QB THIS yr. Terrific move.

Lastly kyle/JL made two other key moves and those were :

1.drafting bigger , faster , meaner, power backs
2. Again trying to find that one super WR (Kupp- like)…neither will be Kupp, but we do have two new candidates for go-to WRs.

Whether we succeeded or not, we'll find out in next couple months. But QB, OL, bigger power backs, and still that elusive ultra super WR to add to our already excellent stable Deebo/ Aiyuk/ jennings have all been traded/drafted/FAed//UDFAed to fix all those things. As an aside, our woeful DBs…again, vastly upgraded. And out of nowhere we got Drake, something most of us didn't see coming. Well, nobody did because he should have been gone long before we picked at #61.

End result is, whatever we were missing in SB and then again last yr in NFCCG…it looks like kyle and JL have finally gotten the talent they need (altho none of these new adds have proved one thing yet) . We all know Kyle has been thinking about what else he could do to win it all….and looking at the above additions, it sure seems he and JL have put us in position to win it all this yr.

Will it all come together and we win it all this yr? Who knows. Maybe it will take a yr to get all parts integrated and it happens next yr. But JL/KS have done a masterful job of recognizing where we HAD to get better, and for now , anyway, it looks like they were successful.

And i still like Kyle to be our HC for the next 10-15 yrs…and hope JL stays that long also. Also, maybe those "decisions" Kyle made that didn't work in
E O G situations were due to not having the talent needed in slots noted above. Maybe it was talent Kyle needed…and not his decisions that got us beat.

Just a thot.

Bigger QB, Bigger OLine, Bigger RB's - I think Kyle is going to play a lot of bully ball in the fourth quarter this year!

in the Falcons loss to the Pats in SB LI, everyone claims Kyle's playcalling was too aggressive.

Originally posted by boast:
in the Falcons loss to the Pats in SB LI, everyone claims Kyle's playcalling was too aggressive.

It wasn't too aggressive... he just did not know what to do when the heat was ON !!

Originally posted by 9moon:

Originally posted by boast:
in the Falcons loss to the Pats in SB LI, everyone claims Kyle's playcalling was too aggressive.

It wasn't too aggressive... he just did not know what to do when the heat was ON !!

agreed, he wasn't throwing the ball and coaching at the same time... kinda like here where Jimmy didn't let kyle throw the ball when the heat was on!!

Originally posted by DRCHOWDER:

Originally posted by 9moon:

Originally posted by boast:
in the Falcons loss to the Pats in SB LI, everyone claims Kyle's playcalling was too aggressive.

It wasn't too aggressive... he just did not know what to do when the heat was ON !!

agreed, he wasn't throwing the ball and coaching at the same time... kinda like here where Jimmy didn't let kyle throw the ball when the heat was on!!

Right though? If guys are open and the QB refuses to pull the trigger, I don't see how that is the playcaller's fault.

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by DRCHOWDER:

Originally posted by 9moon:

Originally posted by boast:
in the Falcons loss to the Pats in SB LI, everyone claims Kyle's playcalling was too aggressive.

It wasn't too aggressive... he just did not know what to do when the heat was ON !!

agreed, he wasn't throwing the ball and coaching at the same time... kinda like here where Jimmy didn't let kyle throw the ball when the heat was on!!

Right though? If guys are open and the QB refuses to pull the trigger, I don't see how that is the playcaller's fault.

Because after 5 seasons that's the guy that play caller chose.

not too many organizations will let a coach continue to bumble his way thru seasons.

up next, a QB who played the least amount of football out of any QB the last 3 years.

y'all love this guy so much you just don't see the obvious mistakes he continues to make.

Originally posted by Big_Daddy:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by DRCHOWDER:

Originally posted by 9moon:

Originally posted by boast:
in the Falcons loss to the Pats in SB LI, everyone claims Kyle's playcalling was too aggressive.

It wasn't too aggressive... he just did not know what to do when the heat was ON !!

agreed, he wasn't throwing the ball and coaching at the same time... kinda like here where Jimmy didn't let kyle throw the ball when the heat was on!!

Right though? If guys are open and the QB refuses to pull the trigger, I don't see how that is the playcaller's fault.

Because after 5 seasons that's the guy that play caller chose.

not too many organizations will let a coach continue to bumble his way thru seasons.

up next, a QB who played the least amount of football out of any QB the last 3 years.

y'all love this guy so much you just don't see the obvious mistakes he continues to make.

Bumble his way?