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Originally posted by Giedi:
You can have your own opinions, but you can't have your own facts my friend.If you don't have facts to back up your opinion, then it's not much of an opinion, in my opinion.
Originally posted by NYniner85:Originally posted by TheWooLick:I never said anyone deserved to be fired, you did.
.
No I didn't. nowhere did I said Kyle SHOULD be fired. I said some have been fired for less, which they have. Your constant twisting of words to argue is so old man.
Originally posted by SLCNiner:
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by Giedi:
"I just wanted to have the ability to be able to look at his meetings, to be able to study the film, personnel as well, in his scheme, and be able to stay on top of it because when he did call me up for my opinion, I want at least a chance to give him an educated opinion. Just not talk in generalities, but be able to talk specifics.Why dont you *prove* to me your point (that he's not a big part of the front office) with some facts.
"Not that he has to call me very often, but it is fun when we do get a chance to talk, we're talking about scheme or personnel. Usually it's about the things that he can't look at. Maybe you're second or third deep at one position, the scout team, or different things that he may see that he might miss. But he doesn't miss very much, I promise you that."
Mike Shanahan gets his access to the footage about 30 minutes after the recordings are completed. He'll start taking a look at it the next day, usually after waking up at 4 a.m. and heading into his home office with the iPad in hand.
"It's kind of neat for me to have it where when he watches something or sees something, he tells me, 'Hey, you guys should've done this or that.'" Kyle Shanahan said. "I look into it what he says. And it's nice to have another set of eyes. Where, 'Hey, I missed that.' I'll go back and check that. Sometimes I agree with him, sometimes I don't
https://www.49erswebzone.com/news/amp-133108/
So it's like Jack harbaugh lol. Come on man, he's not making personnel decisions. He's having convos with his son about football. Kyle is running the ship not old man shanny.
There was a piece that aired last year talking about Mike and how much involvement he has with the team, and it is almost none. Kyle rarely asks his advice on team matters, and Mike doesn't want to be a meddling father.
Originally posted by thl408:
I kind of followed that exchange you guys had and you are both misunderstanding each other, from what I was able to understand (Kyle fired for having done less than the Eagles coach, something like that). I wanted to clear it up but also wanted to see what came of it.
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by thl408:
I kind of followed that exchange you guys had and you are both misunderstanding each other, from what I was able to understand (Kyle fired for having done less than the Eagles coach, something like that). I wanted to clear it up but also wanted to see what came of it.
This is what I said….he's the longest tenured coach in the NFL that has not won a Super Bowl. There has been coaches that have been fired for less & gave an example…He then crapped on Peterson's accomplishments and was incorrect on what actually transpired there.
not once did I say he should be fired. In fact throughout this thread I've said I think he's a bad ass HC and an elite play caller. I've pointed out the need for a legit GM, someone that is 50/50 with Kyle and can view it from a GMs perspective, not just a coach who will tend to build a roster differently.
Originally posted by TheWooLick:
What did he do that has gotten other coaches fired after a 13 win season with a top 5 offense and defense?
What is the More Bad Kyle has done that has gotten others fired?
Originally posted by thl408:
Right. I don't think either one of you said that Kyle should be fired. idk, seems like some sort of misunderstanding either between you two, or me not understanding. I'm lost in this. Either way, Kyle should not be fired unless he somehow loses the locker room. Let him learn and get it right.
Originally posted by Giedi:
Originally posted by SLCNiner:
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by Giedi:
"I just wanted to have the ability to be able to look at his meetings, to be able to study the film, personnel as well, in his scheme, and be able to stay on top of it because when he did call me up for my opinion, I want at least a chance to give him an educated opinion. Just not talk in generalities, but be able to talk specifics.Why dont you *prove* to me your point (that he's not a big part of the front office) with some facts.
"Not that he has to call me very often, but it is fun when we do get a chance to talk, we're talking about scheme or personnel. Usually it's about the things that he can't look at. Maybe you're second or third deep at one position, the scout team, or different things that he may see that he might miss. But he doesn't miss very much, I promise you that."
Mike Shanahan gets his access to the footage about 30 minutes after the recordings are completed. He'll start taking a look at it the next day, usually after waking up at 4 a.m. and heading into his home office with the iPad in hand.
"It's kind of neat for me to have it where when he watches something or sees something, he tells me, 'Hey, you guys should've done this or that.'" Kyle Shanahan said. "I look into it what he says. And it's nice to have another set of eyes. Where, 'Hey, I missed that.' I'll go back and check that. Sometimes I agree with him, sometimes I don't
https://www.49erswebzone.com/news/amp-133108/
So it's like Jack harbaugh lol. Come on man, he's not making personnel decisions. He's having convos with his son about football. Kyle is running the ship not old man shanny.
There was a piece that aired last year talking about Mike and how much involvement he has with the team, and it is almost none. Kyle rarely asks his advice on team matters, and Mike doesn't want to be a meddling father.
Link the interveiw then, so we can all get educated.
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by thl408:
Right. I don't think either one of you said that Kyle should be fired. idk, seems like some sort of misunderstanding either between you two, or me not understanding. I'm lost in this. Either way, Kyle should not be fired unless he somehow loses the locker room. Let him learn and get it right.
it's him twisting what I said to make it sound like I hate kyle or want him fired. He pulls this crap constantly. None of us think he should be fired. I simply said there has been HC fired for less.
Originally posted by Cisco0623:
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by thl408:
Right. I don't think either one of you said that Kyle should be fired. idk, seems like some sort of misunderstanding either between you two, or me not understanding. I'm lost in this. Either way, Kyle should not be fired unless he somehow loses the locker room. Let him learn and get it right.
it's him twisting what I said to make it sound like I hate kyle or want him fired. He pulls this crap constantly. None of us think he should be fired. I simply said there has been HC fired for less.
Yup, but when you question Kyle some folks go ballistic.
The entire point in fans sharing opinions is to share them, and be respectful!
Originally posted by SLCNiner:
It wasn't an interview, just a fluff piece about Mike coming back to SF and checking in on the team. But even the quote you posted comes from a video where he said that, you just didn't include it.
"And how much back and forth do you have with Kyle and the things that you see?"
"You know we don't have a lot because I know how busy he is with what you have to do to to get a gameplan ready."
I don't know, doesn't sound like he's a big part of the FO to me, anyway.
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Totally a reach imo. Kyle is running the ship and overall is been really good. He's f**ked up at the most important position since day 1 and at different spots along the way. His bad ass scheme has covered up a ton of that.
My whole point is coaches overall don't view roster building the same as GMs. It's more emotional and shortsighted. Just is, they're coaches. It's about now and tomorrow we might all be dead lol.
If we had a legit GM that has actually done it and was his equal. I feel like it would be best for everyone. Just my option that's all
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by SLCNiner:
It wasn't an interview, just a fluff piece about Mike coming back to SF and checking in on the team. But even the quote you posted comes from a video where he said that, you just didn't include it.
"And how much back and forth do you have with Kyle and the things that you see?"
"You know we don't have a lot because I know how busy he is with what you have to do to to get a gameplan ready."
I don't know, doesn't sound like he's a big part of the FO to me, anyway.
Totally a reach imo. Kyle is running the ship and overall is been really good. He's f**ked up at the most important position since day 1 and at different spots along the way. His bad ass scheme has covered up a ton of that.
My whole point is coaches overall don't view roster building the same as GMs. It's more emotional and shortsighted. Just is, they're coaches. It's about now and tomorrow we might all be dead lol.
If we had a legit GM that has actually done it and was his equal. I feel like it would be best for everyone. Just my option that's all
Originally posted by Dshearn:
there have been a handful of coaches that were stripped of GM duties to protect the franchise, I don't recall if it was Holghrim or Ried...but one of those two got stripped....and others I am sure they just dont come to mind.
I agree with NY on this one
Shanny 2.0 wanted a certain type of RB from day one and that crashed and burned due to injury, he wanted a certain type of QB that failed to materialize or lacked the ability to stay on the field. He got away with smoke and mirrors for a few years to bridge the gap until he got most of the pieces he wants in the right place.
Coach do tend to think in the short term, they get fired if they don't produce, it is hard for them to worry about 2 years from now let alone 5 years from now.
That is not even bringing up the dog house. Coaches Dog house players THEY lobbied for, players THEY wanted. Look at the circus around Trey Lance. We know Shanny wanted Trey, and we still have people accusing Shanny of not wanting him and derailing his career. They think that way, because they have watched other coaches do JUST THAT.
I can't remember the coach/gm that had a hell of a feud in the 90s....but the coach jack up the GMs picks to make him look bad....I can't remember who it was, but I remember it happening. It lasted like a season and a half and I think one or the other or both was fired. I want to say it was Jerry Glanville with ATL, but I am not sure.....anyway....it has happened.
Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:
Originally posted by Dshearn:
there have been a handful of coaches that were stripped of GM duties to protect the franchise, I don't recall if it was Holghrim or Ried...but one of those two got stripped....and others I am sure they just dont come to mind.
I agree with NY on this one
Shanny 2.0 wanted a certain type of RB from day one and that crashed and burned due to injury, he wanted a certain type of QB that failed to materialize or lacked the ability to stay on the field. He got away with smoke and mirrors for a few years to bridge the gap until he got most of the pieces he wants in the right place.
Coach do tend to think in the short term, they get fired if they don't produce, it is hard for them to worry about 2 years from now let alone 5 years from now.
That is not even bringing up the dog house. Coaches Dog house players THEY lobbied for, players THEY wanted. Look at the circus around Trey Lance. We know Shanny wanted Trey, and we still have people accusing Shanny of not wanting him and derailing his career. They think that way, because they have watched other coaches do JUST THAT.
I can't remember the coach/gm that had a hell of a feud in the 90s....but the coach jack up the GMs picks to make him look bad....I can't remember who it was, but I remember it happening. It lasted like a season and a half and I think one or the other or both was fired. I want to say it was Jerry Glanville with ATL, but I am not sure.....anyway....it has happened.
You certainly can't strip him of GM duties without consequences, the biggest being him potentially wanting out completely. You also might be inviting conflicts behind closed doors that we don't have now with a new head man. His results overall have been great, and there's not necessarily the appropriate reason(s) to consider the move.
A further problem would be actually attracting a great candidate, provided we didn't promote in-house. We went through this when we hired Kyle, when the top GMs we targeted bowed out. I presume this will be the case as long as PM is involved and free of accountability (as was the reported problem with GM candidates at the time).
Given all these things and the actual very good success he's had, this would be a nonsensical move anytime soon. I just think it's worth recognizing we appear to have a structural flaw and the potential issues that come along with it.
