49ers Head Coach Kyle Shanahan Thread

Originally posted by captveg:

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by captveg:
I think it's pretty obvious at this point that Shanahan has trouble evaluating QBs from afar, but when they are on his roster he has a real solid grasp on what those QBs are likely to accomplish.

Are there coaches that evaluate QBs better from afar and worse when the QB is on the roster?

No. But my point was that he's likely below average on the former even when he's above average on the latter.

Gotcha. I hope this whole experience gave him a lesson to draw upon should he be looking for another young QB in the future. The main lesson being to strongly consider the number of years that the college QB was able to be a starter, and how that experience is so valuable in having them ready for the NFL.

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by captveg:

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by captveg:
I think it's pretty obvious at this point that Shanahan has trouble evaluating QBs from afar, but when they are on his roster he has a real solid grasp on what those QBs are likely to accomplish.

Are there coaches that evaluate QBs better from afar and worse when the QB is on the roster?

No. But my point was that he's likely below average on the former even when he's above average on the latter.

Gotcha. I hope this whole experience gave him a lesson to draw upon should he be looking for another young QB in the future. The main lesson being to strongly consider the number of years that the college QB was able to be a starter, and how that experience is so valuable in having them ready for the NFL.

more experienced, less experienced... it's all a crap shoot still

When does the player take all the blame for not panning out

I know everyone is talking about Kyle being a bad QB evaluator, but I think his RB evaluation is even worse, considering how his run game is his specialty and RB is traditionally one of the easiest positions to translate to NFL.

His best drafted RBs were drafted either very late (Mitchell) or undrafted (Breida, Wilson) or journeymen (Mostert)

Conversely, all bigger signings (McKinnon) and higher drafted RBs (Sermon, TDP tbd, Williams) have been pretty disappointing.

CMC of course was an elite established player before getting here.

Originally posted by the_dynasty:
I know everyone is talking about Kyle being a bad QB evaluator, but I think his RB evaluation is even worse, considering how his run game is his specialty and RB is traditionally one of the easiest positions to translate to NFL.

His best drafted RBs were drafted either very late (Mitchell) or undrafted (Breida, Wilson) or journeymen (Mostert)

Conversely, all bigger signings (McKinnon) and higher drafted RBs (Sermon, TDP tbd, Williams) have been pretty disappointing.

CMC of course was an elite established player before getting here.

To be fair, he wasn't wrong about McKinnon, as his years in KC have now proved. Just got s**t luck with his injuries here.

Originally posted by captveg:

Originally posted by the_dynasty:
I know everyone is talking about Kyle being a bad QB evaluator, but I think his RB evaluation is even worse, considering how his run game is his specialty and RB is traditionally one of the easiest positions to translate to NFL.

His best drafted RBs were drafted either very late (Mitchell) or undrafted (Breida, Wilson) or journeymen (Mostert)

Conversely, all bigger signings (McKinnon) and higher drafted RBs (Sermon, TDP tbd, Williams) have been pretty disappointing.

CMC of course was an elite established player before getting here.

To be fair, he wasn't wrong about McKinnon, as his years in KC have now proved. Just got s**t luck with his injuries here.

This. McKinnon was a poor man's CMC.

Originally posted by captveg:
To be fair, he wasn't wrong about McKinnon, as his years in KC have now proved. Just got s**t luck with his injuries here.

This

Originally posted by DonnieDarko:

Originally posted by captveg:
To be fair, he wasn't wrong about McKinnon, as his years in KC have now proved. Just got s**t luck with his injuries here.

This

Agree, and he fleeced the Panthers in the CMC trade. ShanaLynch is getting better and better each year.

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by 9moon:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by 9moon:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by 9moon:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
My one KS critique is as good as he is with the playsheet, he can call games tight with his decision making. Like the Juice up the gut, then punt in plus territory sequence in the NFCCG. We had a bot in real time telling us, that KS was lowering our win odds as it was happening. He should lean more into the analytics imo. Especially with this talent we have now. Rather see CMC, BA, Kittle out there on 4th down than Moody, or Wish. Plus territory punts should be abolished imo. Punts are voluntary turnovers.

Agree he's too conservative at times, especially in 4th and short situations across the 50.

Let's see if that changes with a QB he trusts and potentially a substandard kicking game. I can't necessarily blame him for not taking chances with Jim back there.

With Jimmy, we gone over all the missed plays.

Kyle trusts all his QBs, but do the QBs trust themselves ?

NYAHAHAHAHAH..... Kyle trusts all his QBs?

He gave up the farm for Lance and gave up on Lance after 4 games ??

When i say trust, i meant calling plays to see if the QB can execute (hence, the missed plays comment)

If the QB doesn't execute, thats more on the QB not trusting themselves.

so WHY do you think Aaron often changes McCarthy's play calling?

.. and not sure how long you've been a 49er fan, but if you have been there around the 80s, I'd like to know if you'd blame Joe Montana on the 87 Vikings upset..

What does Aaron, McCarthy, Montana in 87 has to do with Kyle now ?

This is about Trust and the QBs trusting themselves. We don't have time to wait on a QB that needs more than 3 yrs to throw the ball to open players

if that's the case, they why didn't he trade for Brady or Stafford... wasn't it a better decision to give up the same farm on somone named Brady or Stafford?

.. I mean since he wanted to win asap?

But we didn't give up the farm, taking on those guys would have been bad moves also and probably leave us in a worse position today

Uve gots to be joking.. . RIGHT??

Brady would have cost us what?

Stafford's cost would have been as bad as Trey's, but we woulda won the Super Bowl w/him, or with Tom even.

the way I see it, Shanny did not want those QBs because both would have bigger than him and the QBs would have also gotten the credit instead of him..

there is no valid reason as to why he gave up what he gave up for Trey but did not want to give that up for Stafford..

Originally posted by the_dynasty:
I know everyone is talking about Kyle being a bad QB evaluator, but I think his RB evaluation is even worse, considering how his run game is his specialty and RB is traditionally one of the easiest positions to translate to NFL.

His best drafted RBs were drafted either very late (Mitchell) or undrafted (Breida, Wilson) or journeymen (Mostert)

Conversely, all bigger signings (McKinnon) and higher drafted RBs (Sermon, TDP tbd, Williams) have been pretty disappointing.

CMC of course was an elite established player before getting here.

Kyle should stick to evaluating wide receivers.

In retrospect, losing Stafford to the Rams got Kyle all emo, so went big in the draft for younger big arm talent in Lance that had a bit of taste in a prostyle offense albeit inexperienced. But the timing was all wrong. There's no way a young prospect can drive a SB within 1-2 years of development. The expectation was a bit unrealistic. And everything had to go almost perfect, which it was not. Injuries to Lance killed it. Thank goodness the football god smiles upon Kyle's lame attempt, and sent him the Real Deal Brock Purdy. Blew his wad with 3 first round picks, and soothed by getting Brock last pick of the draft.

So now we're right on track since Brock came in last year.

Originally posted by 9moon:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by 9moon:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by 9moon:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by 9moon:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
My one KS critique is as good as he is with the playsheet, he can call games tight with his decision making. Like the Juice up the gut, then punt in plus territory sequence in the NFCCG. We had a bot in real time telling us, that KS was lowering our win odds as it was happening. He should lean more into the analytics imo. Especially with this talent we have now. Rather see CMC, BA, Kittle out there on 4th down than Moody, or Wish. Plus territory punts should be abolished imo. Punts are voluntary turnovers.

Agree he's too conservative at times, especially in 4th and short situations across the 50.

Let's see if that changes with a QB he trusts and potentially a substandard kicking game. I can't necessarily blame him for not taking chances with Jim back there.

With Jimmy, we gone over all the missed plays.

Kyle trusts all his QBs, but do the QBs trust themselves ?

NYAHAHAHAHAH..... Kyle trusts all his QBs?

He gave up the farm for Lance and gave up on Lance after 4 games ??

When i say trust, i meant calling plays to see if the QB can execute (hence, the missed plays comment)

If the QB doesn't execute, thats more on the QB not trusting themselves.

so WHY do you think Aaron often changes McCarthy's play calling?

.. and not sure how long you've been a 49er fan, but if you have been there around the 80s, I'd like to know if you'd blame Joe Montana on the 87 Vikings upset..

What does Aaron, McCarthy, Montana in 87 has to do with Kyle now ?

This is about Trust and the QBs trusting themselves. We don't have time to wait on a QB that needs more than 3 yrs to throw the ball to open players

if that's the case, they why didn't he trade for Brady or Stafford... wasn't it a better decision to give up the same farm on somone named Brady or Stafford?

.. I mean since he wanted to win asap?

But we didn't give up the farm, taking on those guys would have been bad moves also and probably leave us in a worse position today

Uve gots to be joking.. . RIGHT??

Brady would have cost us what?

Stafford's cost would have been as bad as Trey's, but we woulda won the Super Bowl w/him, or with Tom even.

the way I see it, Shanny did not want those QBs because both would have bigger than him and the QBs would have also gotten the credit instead of him..

there is no valid reason as to why he gave up what he gave up for Trey but did not want to give that up for Stafford..

i'm joking, you pretending all these guarantees would have happened. stay in the real world bud. lets take a look

Brady, He was looking real bad coming off that 2019 season. Aren't you blaming Kyle for letting Lance go, but you would be ok letting Jimmy go off a Superbowl run. You don't make sense with that logic. Also how can you fit Jimmy's Guaranteed dead cap 30 mill and sign Brady for 30 mil ? no way would any sane person do that combo

Stafford, Why don't you remember Stafford had his limitations also. While Mcvay got lucky, not one person was thinking Stafford is a Superbowl winning QB. How are the rams and stafford doing now ?

Kyle not wanting the QB to get credit is craziest thing to even think of lol, QB has been the face of every franchise good or bad

Originally posted by qnnhan7:
In retrospect, losing Stafford to the Rams got Kyle all emo, so went big in the draft for younger big arm talent in Lance that had a bit of taste in a prostyle offense albeit inexperienced. But the timing was all wrong. There's no way a young prospect can drive a SB within 1-2 years of development. The expectation was a bit unrealistic. And everything had to go almost perfect, which it was not. Injuries to Lance killed it. Thank goodness the football god smiles upon Kyle's lame attempt, and sent him the Real Deal Brock Purdy. Blew his wad with 3 first round picks, and soothed by getting Brock last pick of the draft.

So now we're right on track since Brock came in last year.

Brock is unreal as a rookie. To me he's worth 3 first round picks. Not the chump change ones either (two of those three first rounders for Trey) were somewhere in the 29th pick. As rookie stats go - that's elite level performance for a rookie. 7th round is the new 5ht round - Brayden Willis, Ronnie Bell, and Jalen Graham all made the team. Who knows if they are going to be let go next year or be the next gold jacket guy. We shall see.

With regards to QB assessment - Jimmy was a nobody in 2017, and here comes Kyle getting him for a 2nd rounder. He takes us to the super bowl and multiple NFC championships. To me that's first round talent there for a 2nd round pick. Brandon Allen looks like another find for Kyle. I'm confident Sam will amount to something as long as he stays and gets accustomed to Kyle's offense. Well see if he sticks around more than one year. BeatHard and Mullens are still in the NFL, so that's saying something with regards to Kyle's ability to develop QB's.

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by qnnhan7:
In retrospect, losing Stafford to the Rams got Kyle all emo, so went big in the draft for younger big arm talent in Lance that had a bit of taste in a prostyle offense albeit inexperienced. But the timing was all wrong. There's no way a young prospect can drive a SB within 1-2 years of development. The expectation was a bit unrealistic. And everything had to go almost perfect, which it was not. Injuries to Lance killed it. Thank goodness the football god smiles upon Kyle's lame attempt, and sent him the Real Deal Brock Purdy. Blew his wad with 3 first round picks, and soothed by getting Brock last pick of the draft.

So now we're right on track since Brock came in last year.

Brock is unreal as a rookie. To me he's worth 3 first round picks. Not the chump change ones either (two of those three first rounders for Trey) were somewhere in the 29th pick. As rookie stats go - that's elite level performance for a rookie. 7th round is the new 5ht round - Brayden Willis, Ronnie Bell, and Jalen Graham all made the team. Who knows if they are going to be let go next year or be the next gold jacket guy. We shall see.

With regards to QB assessment - Jimmy was a nobody in 2017, and here comes Kyle getting him for a 2nd rounder. He takes us to the super bowl and multiple NFC championships. To me that's first round talent there for a 2nd round pick. Brandon Allen looks like another find for Kyle. I'm confident Sam will amount to something as long as he stays and gets accustomed to Kyle's offense. Well see if he sticks around more than one year. BeatHard and Mullens are still in the NFL, so that's saying something with regards to Kyle's ability to develop QB's.

I think Kyle like most exceptional offensive minds in the game, is victim to his only coaching abilities. They tend to think they can create effective offense by teaching those 11 guys that may not be all world talent. On some level it's true. We see almost all his QBs effective playing the position. But at some point he needs to find that Guy to get over the top. Like Walsh with Montana. Belichick with Brady. McVay with Stafford.

I think he finally found one in Brock. And part of the reason he let Lance go without fuss. When he said Brock is the real deal, to me it means Brock didn't luck into those wins last year, or that he was carried by the team. Brock earned those wins, and earned Kyle's trust, be that guy for him this year and hopefully future years.

Originally posted by qnnhan7:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by qnnhan7:
In retrospect, losing Stafford to the Rams got Kyle all emo, so went big in the draft for younger big arm talent in Lance that had a bit of taste in a prostyle offense albeit inexperienced. But the timing was all wrong. There's no way a young prospect can drive a SB within 1-2 years of development. The expectation was a bit unrealistic. And everything had to go almost perfect, which it was not. Injuries to Lance killed it. Thank goodness the football god smiles upon Kyle's lame attempt, and sent him the Real Deal Brock Purdy. Blew his wad with 3 first round picks, and soothed by getting Brock last pick of the draft.

So now we're right on track since Brock came in last year.

Brock is unreal as a rookie. To me he's worth 3 first round picks. Not the chump change ones either (two of those three first rounders for Trey) were somewhere in the 29th pick. As rookie stats go - that's elite level performance for a rookie. 7th round is the new 5ht round - Brayden Willis, Ronnie Bell, and Jalen Graham all made the team. Who knows if they are going to be let go next year or be the next gold jacket guy. We shall see.

With regards to QB assessment - Jimmy was a nobody in 2017, and here comes Kyle getting him for a 2nd rounder. He takes us to the super bowl and multiple NFC championships. To me that's first round talent there for a 2nd round pick. Brandon Allen looks like another find for Kyle. I'm confident Sam will amount to something as long as he stays and gets accustomed to Kyle's offense. Well see if he sticks around more than one year. BeatHard and Mullens are still in the NFL, so that's saying something with regards to Kyle's ability to develop QB's.

I think Kyle like most exceptional offensive minds in the game, is victim to his only coaching abilities. They tend to think they can create effective offense by teaching those 11 guys that may not be all world talent. On some level it's true. We see almost all his QBs effective playing the position. But at some point he needs to find that Guy to get over the top. Like Walsh with Montana. Belichick with Brady. McVay with Stafford.

I think he finally found one in Brock. And part of the reason he let Lance go without fuss. When he said Brock is the real deal, to me it means Brock didn't luck into those wins last year, or that he was carried by the team. Brock earned those wins, and earned Kyle's trust, be that guy for him this year and hopefully future years.

the only thing that i've noticed is, on some critical plays is having the wrong guy on the field blocking.

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
the only thing that i've noticed is, on some critical plays is having the wrong guy on the field blocking.

lol Maybe he was learning to playcall with Brock. Didn't think Brock would look for Aiyuk further down field. He wouldn't have put a 2nd rate TE on a monster DE if he had known