49ers Head Coach Kyle Shanahan Thread

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
Moving all in on Jimmy after 5 games should be on that list imo. Wanting to moving the 2nd overall pick for Kirk (apparently) was a bit extreme also.

there were misses all over the place at QB. The whole process that got them to Lance and how it was handled was a mess. Now handing the keys to a loaded roster to Brock? I mean I'm here for it and to see where it goes…but overall it's been a lot of head scratching stuff at that position.

I also don't want a GM that's unwilling to listen to kyle. There's got to be cohesiveness there, like all the great regimes.

overall I'm complaining about one thing, it's been a bunch of good & we're in a great spot.

Jimmy contract was completely normal in my opinion. It was the timing of his FA, and the fact that he played really well and almost immediately helped reset the culture around the team. Of course they signed him. So would a traditional GM.

I'd agree to add in that trade for Cousins if it is actually real. It's the first we're hearing of it now and I'm not sold that it's legitimate just yet.

Brock played great… absolutely nothing odd about their decision to roll with him, and they did buy some insurance in any case.

Maybe I'm in the minority but I don't think the jimmy contract was a big deal. He may not of lived up to it but it isn't like he was terrible either. When he was healthy, we made it to the NFCC/Super bowl. Regardless of if someone wants to argue if he was good or not, he wasn't bad. He really helped with our culture, the guys loved him. He helped us win a lot of games by doing little things right at qb. He was limited overall but still good as a whole. Best qb we've had in a long long time, IMO. He also handled the whole qb situation as well as you could of asked him to, even when it was probably pretty embarrassing and eventually hopeless for him. Especially when you compare it to how Lance handled it when he didn't win the backup spot, immediately wanted out.

in other words, he didn't live up to the contact but he didn't drastically underplay it either. He was paid like a top 5-8 qb most years and I'd say he was in the 9-12 range for the most part.

id agree that it was a miss as a whole but wasn't a terrible miss. The Lance trade up/selection was horrific, an easy F-. I'd grade the jimmy situation as a B- or B. At least SOMETHING good came from jimmy and he helped us win a lot of games.

If we could go back and rewrite that contract, you'd probably want some injury clauses in there for some bonus reductions. What the 49ers and ShanaLynch didn't know at the time was Jimmy's atrocious durability. If not for Jimmy's durability issues, he'd still be the 49ers QB. And no Brock Purdy or Trey Lance, in my opinion. Jimmy is only 31, so if he was 100% healthy, I'd say Kyle wouldn't be in the market for a new QB at least until 2025.

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by tankle104:
Just depends on what you were looking at. For example, he was rated top 2 (with mahommes) on third downs most seasons. He is top 3 since 2017 (behind Mahomes & Bree's) in EPA, he was top 3 or so on YPA (behind Mahomes).

the issue to me is that what Jimmy was good, he was really good at it. What he sucked at, he was pretty bad at (deep throws, throwing the ball away, second chance plays usually).

I think it's pretty clear that Jimmy did certain things really well that contribute a lot to helping us win. It wasn't flashy or sexy, but his accuracy, third down ability etc was really huge to us sustaining drives and all of that. His last year he was incredible in the red zone. I believe top 5. I've always felt like he didn't get enough credit for that stuff because most people just focus on what he didn't do well. I think he did a lot more well than he didn't. It's over though, it ultimately didn't work out. I expect more out of Brock and am excited about it.

i was never upset about moving off of Jimmy, I just was confused because of the drop off in play between jimmy and Lance was huge and I didn't think Lance gave us a chance to win. I'd of been perfectly fine with us moving off of jimmy for a guy like Brock.

IMO 3rd down ability has so much to do with play calling. They weren't a bunch of 3rd downs of him extend plays and going through a bunch of progressions.

Basically saying Lance couldn't give us a chance to win based off next to nothing is what I find weird in all these arguments. Kind hardly played and yet people had conclusions on him.

I expect way more out of Brock with the way they've handed over the keys. He can't be Jimmy 2.0 that's a failure on this FO/HC (not on Brock).

I agree that third down execution is more than just qb ability but I feel like that argument can be made for just about any aspect of football. At the end of the day, the player has to execute it and Jimmy did a solid job at it. It wasn't a great idea to give Jimmy a record contract after 5 games, I think anyone would agree with that. It was a unique situation though, if we didn't pay him, someone would have. The best thing we could of done was franchise tag him, which in hindsight was probably the right thing to do but that was def a unique situation.

Well I didn't say I made a conclusion on him as a final product. I also made sure to say "I think" - my issue was more of the timing of plugging in a player who was so raw and asking him to lead us to a super bowl, that just doesn't make sense to me for any super raw qb. I thought he looked pretty bad the few times he did play, which he became essentially worthless Trade value wise because of how raw he was and how not ready he is. The injuries don't really have much to do with it, IMO. Jimmy had broken bones and injuries in a similar manner but played well in his few moments and was worth a 1-2 round pick at the time.

it'll be interesting to see how Lance does going forward cause his story isn't written yet. If he does ever do well, I hope it's not with a 49ers rival. Lol would of been nice to send him somewhere else were we could root for him to succeed.

i just want to see Brock continue to improve and learn from his mistakes/experiences. Refine his play, and build on what he did last year. See how he starts developing. I'm really excited to watch him play but he is still young and inexperienced at this stage, so it could go in any direction, but I think his foundation to build off of is pretty exciting. They handed the keys to Jimmy and Lance the same way, so I don't see an issue with that. Sometimes it's better to declare a "guy" and go forward with one guy instead of splitting everything and hurting the overall team because everything is split between two QBs. Time will tell if this situation was the right time.

Yup, swing and misses. At least they tried. You miss 100% of the shots you don't take.

With the QB position, you almost have to do that constantly, because it's such a hard position to scout and project from. The NFL speed is insane, the gamesmanship and defensive play is so complicated. Until you see a guy perform under pressure in the bright lights, you won't really know. Add in the hidden variable that you can't really even scout for - which is durability - and you have a really tough time guessing right even 30% of the time. QB confidence can be so easily lost. Once lost, it's really hard to regain.

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
Moving all in on Jimmy after 5 games should be on that list imo. Wanting to moving the 2nd overall pick for Kirk (apparently) was a bit extreme also.

there were misses all over the place at QB. The whole process that got them to Lance and how it was handled was a mess. Now handing the keys to a loaded roster to Brock? I mean I'm here for it and to see where it goes…but overall it's been a lot of head scratching stuff at that position.

I also don't want a GM that's unwilling to listen to kyle. There's got to be cohesiveness there, like all the great regimes.

overall I'm complaining about one thing, it's been a bunch of good & we're in a great spot.

Jimmy contract was completely normal in my opinion. It was the timing of his FA, and the fact that he played really well and almost immediately helped reset the culture around the team. Of course they signed him. So would a traditional GM.

I'd agree to add in that trade for Cousins if it is actually real. It's the first we're hearing of it now and I'm not sold that it's legitimate just yet.

Brock played great… absolutely nothing odd about their decision to roll with him, and they did buy some insurance in any case.

Maybe I'm in the minority but I don't think the jimmy contract was a big deal. He may not of lived up to it but it isn't like he was terrible either. When he was healthy, we made it to the NFCC/Super bowl. Regardless of if someone wants to argue if he was good or not, he wasn't bad. He really helped with our culture, the guys loved him. He helped us win a lot of games by doing little things right at qb. He was limited overall but still good as a whole. Best qb we've had in a long long time, IMO. He also handled the whole qb situation as well as you could of asked him to, even when it was probably pretty embarrassing and eventually hopeless for him. Especially when you compare it to how Lance handled it when he didn't win the backup spot, immediately wanted out.

in other words, he didn't live up to the contact but he didn't drastically underplay it either. He was paid like a top 5-8 qb most years and I'd say he was in the 9-12 range for the most part.

id agree that it was a miss as a whole but wasn't a terrible miss. The Lance trade up/selection was horrific, an easy F-. I'd grade the jimmy situation as a B- or B. At least SOMETHING good came from jimmy and he helped us win a lot of games.

If we could go back and rewrite that contract, you'd probably want some injury clauses in there for some bonus reductions. What the 49ers and ShanaLynch didn't know at the time was Jimmy's atrocious durability. If not for Jimmy's durability issues, he'd still be the 49ers QB. And no Brock Purdy or Trey Lance, in my opinion. Jimmy is only 31, so if he was 100% healthy, I'd say Kyle wouldn't be in the market for a new QB at least until 2025.

I'd agree with you on this but I think there is more to this story than we know, and probably won't find out until someone writes a book or so. I think Jimmy frustrated Kyle, and vice versa, more than we know. I think they had a lot of friction and see the game different - I also think jimmy wanted more control and influence over the offense and Kyle didn't trust him to do it, cause they saw it all differently. I'm not saying either is right or wrong, I just don't think it was the best personality match.

i think Brock and Kyle are a lot more cohesive and confident in each other and the way they see the game. That's just my guess and interpretation.

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by tankle104:
Just depends on what you were looking at. For example, he was rated top 2 (with mahommes) on third downs most seasons. He is top 3 since 2017 (behind Mahomes & Bree's) in EPA, he was top 3 or so on YPA (behind Mahomes).

the issue to me is that what Jimmy was good, he was really good at it. What he sucked at, he was pretty bad at (deep throws, throwing the ball away, second chance plays usually).

I think it's pretty clear that Jimmy did certain things really well that contribute a lot to helping us win. It wasn't flashy or sexy, but his accuracy, third down ability etc was really huge to us sustaining drives and all of that. His last year he was incredible in the red zone. I believe top 5. I've always felt like he didn't get enough credit for that stuff because most people just focus on what he didn't do well. I think he did a lot more well than he didn't. It's over though, it ultimately didn't work out. I expect more out of Brock and am excited about it.

i was never upset about moving off of Jimmy, I just was confused because of the drop off in play between jimmy and Lance was huge and I didn't think Lance gave us a chance to win. I'd of been perfectly fine with us moving off of jimmy for a guy like Brock.

IMO 3rd down ability has so much to do with play calling. They weren't a bunch of 3rd downs of him extend plays and going through a bunch of progressions.

Basically saying Lance couldn't give us a chance to win based off next to nothing is what I find weird in all these arguments. Kind hardly played and yet people had conclusions on him.

I expect way more out of Brock with the way they've handed over the keys. He can't be Jimmy 2.0 that's a failure on this FO/HC (not on Brock).

I agree that third down execution is more than just qb ability but I feel like that argument can be made for just about any aspect of football. At the end of the day, the player has to execute it and Jimmy did a solid job at it. It wasn't a great idea to give Jimmy a record contract after 5 games, I think anyone would agree with that. It was a unique situation though, if we didn't pay him, someone would have. The best thing we could of done was franchise tag him, which in hindsight was probably the right thing to do but that was def a unique situation.

Well I didn't say I made a conclusion on him as a final product. I also made sure to say "I think" - my issue was more of the timing of plugging in a player who was so raw and asking him to lead us to a super bowl, that just doesn't make sense to me for any super raw qb. I thought he looked pretty bad the few times he did play, which he became essentially worthless Trade value wise because of how raw he was and how not ready he is. The injuries don't really have much to do with it, IMO. Jimmy had broken bones and injuries in a similar manner but played well in his few moments and was worth a 1-2 round pick at the time.

it'll be interesting to see how Lance does going forward cause his story isn't written yet. If he does ever do well, I hope it's not with a 49ers rival. Lol would of been nice to send him somewhere else were we could root for him to succeed.

i just want to see Brock continue to improve and learn from his mistakes/experiences. Refine his play, and build on what he did last year. See how he starts developing. I'm really excited to watch him play but he is still young and inexperienced at this stage, so it could go in any direction, but I think his foundation to build off of is pretty exciting. They handed the keys to Jimmy and Lance the same way, so I don't see an issue with that. Sometimes it's better to declare a "guy" and go forward with one guy instead of splitting everything and hurting the overall team because everything is split between two QBs. Time will tell if this situation was the right time.

Yup, swing and misses. At least they tried. You miss 100% of the shots you don't take.

With the QB position, you almost have to do that constantly, because it's such a hard position to scout and project from. The NFL speed is insane, the gamesmanship and defensive play is so complicated. Until you see a guy perform under pressure in the bright lights, you won't really know. Add in the hidden variable that you can't really even scout for - which is durability - and you have a really tough time guessing right even 30% of the time. QB confidence can be so easily lost. Once lost, it's really hard to regain.

Yeah, I think they if you don't have a "franchise qb", you should continually try and draft one in the mid to late rounds and see if you get lucky eventually.

we drafted Brock because Kyle wanted a young guy to mold on the roster, it really had nothing to do with jimmy or Brock. I think it was partially due to having a cheap qb on the backend that has been in the system if we need him. We just got lucky Brock has been such a baller. Lol

Originally posted by tankle104:
Yeah, I think they if you don't have a "franchise qb", you should continually try and draft one in the mid to late rounds and see if you get lucky eventually.

we drafted Brock because Kyle wanted a young guy to mold on the roster, it really had nothing to do with jimmy or Brock. I think it was partially due to having a cheap qb on the backend that has been in the system if we need him. We just got lucky Brock has been such a baller. Lol

Kyle/Lynch has said it from the beginning, they will explore all options to make this team better

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by tankle104:
Yeah, I think they if you don't have a "franchise qb", you should continually try and draft one in the mid to late rounds and see if you get lucky eventually.

we drafted Brock because Kyle wanted a young guy to mold on the roster, it really had nothing to do with jimmy or Brock. I think it was partially due to having a cheap qb on the backend that has been in the system if we need him. We just got lucky Brock has been such a baller. Lol

Kyle/Lynch has said it from the beginning, they will explore all options to make this team better

It helps that we have ownership who is committed to spending to help the team. Gotta give jed kudos for helping us with all this cash upfront.

not every team owner would do that. even though we haven't won one yet, I love the cohesion between kyle/John/jed. They seem to all be aligned with the end goal

2nd overall pick for Kirk Cousins?

The 12th pick for Sam F'n Darnold???

If John Lynch ever leaves, we are f**ked. When Kyle is determined to get his guy, he will try to go all out!

Just a post about how brilliant our HC is.

Originally posted by Giedi:

George Kittle breaks down the secret to Kyle Shanahan's explosive plays: "If he wants to set up a play action pass or bootleg, he will call a run play that he knows isn't going to work…" George is so good at talking about this. pic.twitter.com/LIInE8ZKK8

— Kevin Clark (@bykevinclark) June 14, 2023

Just a post about how brilliant our HC is.

It's all about the chess match. He runs this b***h. Just gotta hit those set-ups.

AIGHT so IJS it's the first quarter...looks like the niners are going to dominate on BOTH sides of the ball....

KYLE BETTER sit the Pro bowlers in the 3rd if niners are up by 23 points.

another small flaw of Kyle is .......HIKING THE DAMN BALL OFF before an obvious challenge flag is coming. No hustle to the snap, motioning players....HIKE THE DAM BALL.

27-7 . 3rd quarter..

McCaffrey still in.
Purdy. Kittle. Trent. Aiyuk.Deebo all still in.

I would rest CMC, Trent Aiyuk and Deebo...great point. Game over. If defense lets em back in switch back?

CMC most importantly he's got his hundo, has injury history and the game is fin.

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by tankle104:

Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
Moving all in on Jimmy after 5 games should be on that list imo. Wanting to moving the 2nd overall pick for Kirk (apparently) was a bit extreme also.

there were misses all over the place at QB. The whole process that got them to Lance and how it was handled was a mess. Now handing the keys to a loaded roster to Brock? I mean I'm here for it and to see where it goes…but overall it's been a lot of head scratching stuff at that position.

I also don't want a GM that's unwilling to listen to kyle. There's got to be cohesiveness there, like all the great regimes.

overall I'm complaining about one thing, it's been a bunch of good & we're in a great spot.

Jimmy contract was completely normal in my opinion. It was the timing of his FA, and the fact that he played really well and almost immediately helped reset the culture around the team. Of course they signed him. So would a traditional GM.

I'd agree to add in that trade for Cousins if it is actually real. It's the first we're hearing of it now and I'm not sold that it's legitimate just yet.

Brock played great… absolutely nothing odd about their decision to roll with him, and they did buy some insurance in any case.

Maybe I'm in the minority but I don't think the jimmy contract was a big deal. He may not of lived up to it but it isn't like he was terrible either. When he was healthy, we made it to the NFCC/Super bowl. Regardless of if someone wants to argue if he was good or not, he wasn't bad. He really helped with our culture, the guys loved him. He helped us win a lot of games by doing little things right at qb. He was limited overall but still good as a whole. Best qb we've had in a long long time, IMO. He also handled the whole qb situation as well as you could of asked him to, even when it was probably pretty embarrassing and eventually hopeless for him. Especially when you compare it to how Lance handled it when he didn't win the backup spot, immediately wanted out.

in other words, he didn't live up to the contact but he didn't drastically underplay it either. He was paid like a top 5-8 qb most years and I'd say he was in the 9-12 range for the most part.

id agree that it was a miss as a whole but wasn't a terrible miss. The Lance trade up/selection was horrific, an easy F-. I'd grade the jimmy situation as a B- or B. At least SOMETHING good came from jimmy and he helped us win a lot of games.

If we could go back and rewrite that contract, you'd probably want some injury clauses in there for some bonus reductions. What the 49ers and ShanaLynch didn't know at the time was Jimmy's atrocious durability. If not for Jimmy's durability issues, he'd still be the 49ers QB. And no Brock Purdy or Trey Lance, in my opinion. Jimmy is only 31, so if he was 100% healthy, I'd say Kyle wouldn't be in the market for a new QB at least until 2025.

I'd agree with you on this but I think there is more to this story than we know, and probably won't find out until someone writes a book or so. I think Jimmy frustrated Kyle, and vice versa, more than we know. I think they had a lot of friction and see the game different - I also think jimmy wanted more control and influence over the offense and Kyle didn't trust him to do it, cause they saw it all differently. I'm not saying either is right or wrong, I just don't think it was the best personality match.

i think Brock and Kyle are a lot more cohesive and confident in each other and the way they see the game. That's just my guess and interpretation.

No, you are correct.

Originally posted by TonyStarks:
27-7 . 3rd quarter..

McCaffrey still in.
Purdy. Kittle. Trent. Aiyuk.Deebo all still in.

Game is still in doubt. Today's NFL any team can come back from a 20-pt lead at almost anytime.