49ers Head Coach Kyle Shanahan Thread

Originally posted by Bringbackedjr:
Thank you. I already had the facts. Others may benefit from your advice though. By the way, how do you judge foolishness? Is it on a scale system, 1 being least foolish and 10 being the HC that did know the overtime rules and decided to take the ball? Wait, that can't be… Kyle is always right …even when he isn't.

For starters you actually thinking Kyle didn't know the OT rules…

Or you thinking that taking the ball is absolutely the wrong decision when analytics and the actual game favored the decision even if incredibly slightly.

When you can't point to a single play or decision that didn't kill the team or put them at a competitive disadvantage then bringing up the record is all you have.

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by Bringbackedjr:
Thank you. I already had the facts. Others may benefit from your advice though. By the way, how do you judge foolishness? Is it on a scale system, 1 being least foolish and 10 being the HC that did know the overtime rules and decided to take the ball? Wait, that can't be… Kyle is always right …even when he isn't.

For starters you actually thinking Kyle didn't know the OT rules…

Or you thinking that taking the ball is absolutely the wrong decision when analytics and the actual game favored the decision even if incredibly slightly.

When you can't point to a single play or decision that didn't kill the team or put them at a competitive disadvantage then bringing up the record is all you have.

After some time removed from the trauma of the superbowl loss, I've changed my mind on the OT decision. It was the right call. The defense was tired so if we gave KC the ball they would probably would have marched down and scored 7. We would score 7 and then KC gets the ball and wins with a field goal our D was spent and Greenlaws injury was a major hole in our D.

Just my perspective after some time away from the loss. I was on the why did he not give the ball to KC first team.

Originally posted by bassmanr:

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by Bringbackedjr:
Thank you. I already had the facts. Others may benefit from your advice though. By the way, how do you judge foolishness? Is it on a scale system, 1 being least foolish and 10 being the HC that did know the overtime rules and decided to take the ball? Wait, that can't be… Kyle is always right …even when he isn't.

For starters you actually thinking Kyle didn't know the OT rules…

Or you thinking that taking the ball is absolutely the wrong decision when analytics and the actual game favored the decision even if incredibly slightly.

When you can't point to a single play or decision that didn't kill the team or put them at a competitive disadvantage then bringing up the record is all you have.

After some time removed from the trauma of the superbowl loss, I've changed my mind on the OT decision. It was the right call. The defense was tired so if we gave KC the ball they would probably would have marched down and scored 7. We would score 7 and then KC gets the ball and wins with a field goal our D was spent and Greenlaws injury was a major hole in our D.

Just my perspective after some time away from the loss. I was on the why did he not give the ball to KC first team.

Kyle's logic was right. It just didn't turn out right. He was expecting the defense to stop KC when they got the ball and they couldn't. Partly because they were tired (who wasn't by that point) and partly because Mahomes and company are just good in crunch time. We saw it the last time we faced them in a SB. Stop the Chiefs all day and when the chips are down Mahomes makes plays. How many teams used to say that about Montana. I know the Bengals and Cowboys did.

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:

Originally posted by bassmanr:

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by Bringbackedjr:
Thank you. I already had the facts. Others may benefit from your advice though. By the way, how do you judge foolishness? Is it on a scale system, 1 being least foolish and 10 being the HC that did know the overtime rules and decided to take the ball? Wait, that can't be… Kyle is always right …even when he isn't.

For starters you actually thinking Kyle didn't know the OT rules…

Or you thinking that taking the ball is absolutely the wrong decision when analytics and the actual game favored the decision even if incredibly slightly.

When you can't point to a single play or decision that didn't kill the team or put them at a competitive disadvantage then bringing up the record is all you have.

After some time removed from the trauma of the superbowl loss, I've changed my mind on the OT decision. It was the right call. The defense was tired so if we gave KC the ball they would probably would have marched down and scored 7. We would score 7 and then KC gets the ball and wins with a field goal our D was spent and Greenlaws injury was a major hole in our D.

Just my perspective after some time away from the loss. I was on the why did he not give the ball to KC first team.

Kyle's logic was right. It just didn't turn out right. He was expecting the defense to stop KC when they got the ball and they couldn't. Partly because they were tired (who wasn't by that point) and partly because Mahomes and company are just good in crunch time. We saw it the last time we faced them in a SB. Stop the Chiefs all day and when the chips are down Mahomes makes plays. How many teams used to say that about Montana. I know the Bengals and Cowboys did.

Cowboys - u talkin about the 81 NFCCG.. right? The Catch would have been MEANINGLESS had Eric Wright did not catch 88 on a horse collar tackle...

SHANNY sucks... he can't game plan and he can't make the PROPER call when necessary !!

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by Giedi:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

offensive plays that gained 30+ yards last yr

36 - SF*
35
34
33 - GB*
32 - MIA*, LAR*
31
30 - IND
29
28 - BAL*
27 - DET*, SEA
26 - KC*, CLE*, DAL*
25 - TB*, DEN
24
23 - PHI*, TEN
22 - BUF*, NO, CHI, JAX, NYG, MIN
21 - PIT*, ATL, CIN
20 - HOU*, LAC
19 - WAS, ARI
18 - NYJ
17 - LV…

— Warren Sharp (@SharpFootball) July 13, 2024

Those stats point out to me how aggressive Kyle is with wanting to have those big plays. He'll sacrifice plays to get those big chunk plays vs stringing along a lot of little plays and winning via patience and execution. Nothing wrong with that, Don Coryell and Al Davis were proponents of those kinds of big play offenses. Kyle's offenses are still ball control *but with* a big play component to the ball control - so it's not entirely an all or nothing offense.

It's his defense that chaps my hide. The wide 9 is a bad defense to play against the run, and while I can see the wide 9 advantages against the pass happy NFL, you need an all around elite DLine to really make it work. Kinlaw, Chase, Drakeford and Gregory were simply not up to snuff. To put them in a bad scheme along with inadequate talent still really makes me peeved.

I think the run issues weren't scheme related. Wide 9 isn't as strong vs the run but it's a passing league these days. If the offense does their job it will put more pressure on the other teams where they'll be forced to pass more.

Also with Fred and Dre able to cover a lot of ground we're able to close the holes in the wide 9 and still keep guys from gashing us in the run. The DT play will be interesting. Once AA got hurt we took a big step back and obviously Dre won't be back early in the season.

We'll need the guys to step up and hold it down.

It's still a weird defense. The wide 9 married to the Pete Carroll/George Seifert back end coverages - is not a defense that's common in the NFL. It takes a unique coach to operate that defense. So when Kyle loses a DC, he loses more than just a DC - he loses the advantages that the scheme generates on the kind of defensive personnel Kyle has. Somebody like Wilks coming in, can't replace the experience needed to operate that unique defense. Mike Shanahan was considered an offensive genius when he came into the 49ers in the early '90s and adopted the WCO instead of brining his own offensive system. You need a guy like that instead of Wilks. Of course this is all in hindsight - I wouldn't have known this, at this time last year, until I saw it happen in the Superbowl and his subsequent firing.

The folks who are bashing Kyle for his Superbowl coaching failures are really (in my opinion) actually talking about the defensive coaching failures. Kyle is responsible for the loss, but he's not the *cause* of those Superbowl losses.

Originally posted by 9moon:

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:

Originally posted by bassmanr:

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by Bringbackedjr:
Thank you. I already had the facts. Others may benefit from your advice though. By the way, how do you judge foolishness? Is it on a scale system, 1 being least foolish and 10 being the HC that did know the overtime rules and decided to take the ball? Wait, that can't be… Kyle is always right …even when he isn't.

For starters you actually thinking Kyle didn't know the OT rules…

Or you thinking that taking the ball is absolutely the wrong decision when analytics and the actual game favored the decision even if incredibly slightly.

When you can't point to a single play or decision that didn't kill the team or put them at a competitive disadvantage then bringing up the record is all you have.

After some time removed from the trauma of the superbowl loss, I've changed my mind on the OT decision. It was the right call. The defense was tired so if we gave KC the ball they would probably would have marched down and scored 7. We would score 7 and then KC gets the ball and wins with a field goal our D was spent and Greenlaws injury was a major hole in our D.

Just my perspective after some time away from the loss. I was on the why did he not give the ball to KC first team.

Kyle's logic was right. It just didn't turn out right. He was expecting the defense to stop KC when they got the ball and they couldn't. Partly because they were tired (who wasn't by that point) and partly because Mahomes and company are just good in crunch time. We saw it the last time we faced them in a SB. Stop the Chiefs all day and when the chips are down Mahomes makes plays. How many teams used to say that about Montana. I know the Bengals and Cowboys did.

Cowboys - u talkin about the 81 NFCCG.. right? The Catch would have been MEANINGLESS had Eric Wright did not catch 88 on a horse collar tackle...

SHANNY sucks... he can't game plan and he can't make the PROPER call when necessary !!

Personally, I think Kyle is very good with offensive game planning and offensive coaching. I think he's not taking advantage of his offensive genius by devoting more football (draft/cap/free agency) resources to the defense. In other words, give Kyle the Eagles offensive line (for example), and he can line up three Jauan Jennings (i.e. 7th round level WR talent) and still move the ball on most - if not all defenses.

Beef up the OLine and DLines and devote more resources to the DB side of the ball (as well as keeping up the DLine talent level) and have Kyle forego the Pearsalls and go with more of the Puni's. I agree with NY85 though - that Kyle does need that TE and X receiver to operate his offense. Those should be at minimum day two level talent. Point being, give Kyle a good OLine like the Eagles OLine, and a top of the line defense - and I think with Purdy - that's going to win a lot of championships.

Originally posted by 9moon:
Cowboys - u talkin about the 81 NFCCG.. right? The Catch would have been MEANINGLESS had Eric Wright did not catch 88 on a horse collar tackle...

SHANNY sucks... he can't game plan and he can't make the PROPER call when necessary !!

A coach that can get his team to the SB twice in 5 years, by definition, doesn't suck. The coach that rebuilt a team from nothing to greatness. Take your childish, insipid, trolling and go back under the rock that covers you. Or just maybe, grow up!

Originally posted by eastie:

Originally posted by 9moon:
Cowboys - u talkin about the 81 NFCCG.. right? The Catch would have been MEANINGLESS had Eric Wright did not catch 88 on a horse collar tackle...

SHANNY sucks... he can't game plan and he can't make the PROPER call when necessary !!

A coach that can get his team to the SB twice in 5 years, by definition, doesn't suck. The coach that rebuilt a team from nothing to greatness. Take your childish, insipid, trolling and go back under the rock that covers you. Or just maybe, grow up!

9moon giving cowboy fans a run for their money as being the dumbest fans

He definitely doesn't suck but in superbowls, I wanna see what drunk Kyle would do.

Originally posted by Montana:
He definitely doesn't suck but in superbowls, I wanna see what drunk Kyle would do.

How about just a better DC? He got a better QB and the offense vs a great challenge from KC managed to get the lead every time in the 4th quarter and OT.

Kyle did his job even if people expect TDs and not FGs every time. Wilks didn't do his and yet people claim Kyle is the choker who can't get it done in key moments…

And yes we can blame Kyle for hiring Wilks in the first place but let's not forget Saleh was like his 3rd choice in 2017 and he turned into a really good DC who left for a HC job. DeMeco followed him and did the same thing.

Only so many DC candidates who fit our scheme available when our guys are getting hired after deep playoff runs. Hopefully Sorensen hits just like DeMeco did and sticks around for a few seasons.

Originally posted by Montana:
He definitely doesn't suck but in superbowls, I wanna see what drunk Kyle would do.

You may be on to something.. Though I suck at almost everything I did drunk doesn't mean it won't work for Kyle.

Originally posted by eastie:

Originally posted by 9moon:
Cowboys - u talkin about the 81 NFCCG.. right? The Catch would have been MEANINGLESS had Eric Wright did not catch 88 on a horse collar tackle...

SHANNY sucks... he can't game plan and he can't make the PROPER call when necessary !!

A coach that can get his team to the SB twice in 5 years, by definition, doesn't suck. The coach that rebuilt a team from nothing to greatness. Take your childish, insipid, trolling and go back under the rock that covers you. Or just maybe, grow up!

GREATNESS?

Originally posted by bassmanr:

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by Bringbackedjr:
Thank you. I already had the facts. Others may benefit from your advice though. By the way, how do you judge foolishness? Is it on a scale system, 1 being least foolish and 10 being the HC that did know the overtime rules and decided to take the ball? Wait, that can't be… Kyle is always right …even when he isn't.

For starters you actually thinking Kyle didn't know the OT rules…

Or you thinking that taking the ball is absolutely the wrong decision when analytics and the actual game favored the decision even if incredibly slightly.

When you can't point to a single play or decision that didn't kill the team or put them at a competitive disadvantage then bringing up the record is all you have.

After some time removed from the trauma of the superbowl loss, I've changed my mind on the OT decision. It was the right call. The defense was tired so if we gave KC the ball they would probably would have marched down and scored 7. We would score 7 and then KC gets the ball and wins with a field goal our D was spent and Greenlaws injury was a major hole in our D.

Just my perspective after some time away from the loss. I was on the why did he not give the ball to KC first team.

If that's the case, then Kyle needs to go into that overtime with the mentality of scoring a touchdown and nothing less. You know the probability of Mahomes scoring a TD is high so put you put it all on the table and go for the kill shot. Too bad he settled for a FG and expected that same tired defense to hold.

Kyle sucks.

Originally posted by 9moon:

Originally posted by eastie:

Originally posted by 9moon:
Cowboys - u talkin about the 81 NFCCG.. right? The Catch would have been MEANINGLESS had Eric Wright did not catch 88 on a horse collar tackle...

SHANNY sucks... he can't game plan and he can't make the PROPER call when necessary !!

A coach that can get his team to the SB twice in 5 years, by definition, doesn't suck. The coach that rebuilt a team from nothing to greatness. Take your childish, insipid, trolling and go back under the rock that covers you. Or just maybe, grow up!

GREATNESS?

Yes, we define "greatness" by playoff appearances and SB losses. I'm willing to bet a lot of these guys have Kyle ranked as the second "greatest" coach in our storied history behind Walsh.

Originally posted by genus49:
How about just a better DC? He got a better QB and the offense vs a great challenge from KC managed to get the lead every time in the 4th quarter and OT.

Kyle did his job even if people expect TDs and not FGs every time. Wilks didn't do his and yet people claim Kyle is the choker who can't get it done in key moments…

And yes we can blame Kyle for hiring Wilks in the first place but let's not forget Saleh was like his 3rd choice in 2017 and he turned into a really good DC who left for a HC job. DeMeco followed him and did the same thing.

Only so many DC candidates who fit our scheme available when our guys are getting hired after deep playoff runs. Hopefully Sorensen hits just like DeMeco did and sticks around for a few seasons.

Lol I was calling for Wilks to be replaced all season pretty much..guess Kyle didn't get the memo. But I think it was probably too late to get another DC? Idk though, maybe he could have made it happen. And yeah, I mean, I don't understand why Wilks was hired..not super impressive record wise, overall. I wasn't surprised at all that they cut him after our season ended. At times, I thought Wilks did well but then he would go back to his old, comfortable ways. It is like, he couldn't break from it. It is Kyle's job to hire a coach that is competent and has a great record. To say he is not responsible on any level.. I mean, he made the decision to hire this guy lol.

But maybe he didn't foresee the extent of which Wilks was in over his head. He wasn't meant to be on a team that is such a high level, Brock, on the other hand..totally gets it. He understands that what is expected, it is to be completely stellar, this is the 49ers..this is what the 9ers represent, excellence, this is what you signed up for. Though, not everyone has the talent or are of the right fit to be on such a team.

One can't be stuck in certain mindsets, one has to be fluid and learn new things, probably constantly..again, Brock is great for this. Wilks was limited by his mindsets and what he knew as a D.C. before the 9ers. It is like he really had to force himself to change and it just really didn't happen on the level that it needed to. Wilks just wasn't one of those with the skills needed for a Kyle run/49ers team. It was a mismatch. But that is over now, hopefully, the next one will be more of a fit.