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49ers Head Coach Kyle Shanahan Thread

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49ers Head Coach Kyle Shanahan Thread

Originally posted by captveg:
Originally posted by LifelongNiner:
I just think it's time we slowly started turning over the roster.

They've always been turning over the roster. There's only seven guys left from the 2019 roster, for example: Juice, Kittle, Deebo, Warner, Greenlaw, Bosa, Wishnowsky. People just don't notice this happening year to year.

The top people we are relying on are mostly the same. This is what I'm referring to. Of course we have had drafts, brought in free agents, etc, but the key guys we rely on are largely the same. The team letting go of Jimmie Ward, Armstead, and not resigning Gould was pretty big.

Now, think fo all of the NFC contenders. Of course their rosters are newer because those teams weren't good. KC looks more or less like a completely different team save for Mahommes, Kelsey, and Jones. This is why I made the comment about hunger and bodies breaking down.
  • DrEll
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 7,616
Originally posted by English:
Originally posted by DrEll:
Actually I'm not. That's why I expect SB or bust year in and year out. It's the young lazy fans that enjoy the "journey"…the "camaraderie"….the "effort" the team gives week in and week out. It's lame. As I've said before, EddieD would not have stood for this BS. Kyle would likely have been tossed after he lost that Rams NFCC game, giving up his second 10 point lead in the closing moments.

the Jed Yorks of this world only care about the revenue. They have the youngsters duped…

Um, I don't know how old you are, but you should be aware that Eddie DeBartolo pressured Bill Walsh out of the Niners. And very much as tossing Shanahan out now would be a massive mistake, that was a huge error too. Just because Eddie DeBartolo did it doesn't make it right.

Seifert won two SBs after Eddie D pressured Bill Walsh out. And he fired Seifert for not overcoming the Packers, despite winning 2 SBs. That is the standard our coaching staff should be held to, not "well at least he makes us competitive every year".
Originally posted by Afrikan:
Turning over the roster?

Why not let another coach take over with this roster?.. before feeling we need to start over? We've seen that happen before in this league (and other sports). A Coach only does so much with a talented roster, different guy comes in... makes most of that roster and those opportunities.

Kyle was given an cheating team these last few years... and even more so when he lucked into Christian McCaffrey.

You expect him to have a less talented roster and...somehow do better? Pfffff... nope... I ain't dealing with another 5years of Kyle rebuilding this team, JUST to stick with the same mentality that gets him to lose Super Bowls by the time we get better.

Fuuuuuck that!

Because that's just a crapshoot. That is literally what led to us getting Jim Tomsula. The reality is you are most likely going to get a coach that is worse. The better coach (Reid) ain't available. All of the other hot names (like Ben Johnson), are just that- hot names. Hot names with no long term track record of running successful offenses. You are making a change and hoping for better. Successful coaches are more likely to conitnue winning, even with different players. Kyle didn't come here with 1-2 years of success. He had demonstrated he could run good offenses in Atlanta, Washington, and Houston. Every where he went, the offenses were top notch. So I can be sure it's more him than just lucking into players. No one except for Andy Reid has that kind of pedigree and I'm not looking to do the Tomsula experiment again hoping we catch lightning in a bottle. It's a sad reality and I hate it, because it's little tweaks here or there and we are at worst a 1 time Super Bowl winner. But we have no idea how anyone else would've done.

Beyond running good offenses, we've seen he can build a good team from the absolute bottom. Damn near a juggernaut, minus the trophies. Sean McVay is trying to do that now (he had talent when he arrived in LA). Maybe he might have done a better job? But it still remains to be seen if he can build up a top team the way he has to now and even then, he still has a better head start than what Kyle had in 2017.

I expect him to consistently get us there moreso than any other coach save for Andy Reid. And even then, I wonder how Reid looks without Mahommes. We do have the Philly years to look at which seem a lot like Kyle's. And I'd argue McNabb is far better than Garoppolo.

I will say this, as far as his weaknesses go- does anyone on the staff even challenge his special team's philsophy? We know for sure Schneider doesn't, so I have no hope in that regard that special teams will ever even be average on this team. It's kind of wild for a team that invests such high draft picks in their kicker and punter, that the head coach only wants special teams to not F up.

Originally posted by mcwoot:
Originally posted by captveg:
Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

It's so annoying to see the blame on Kyle's offense. The blame Kyle deserves is on his defense and special teams. Stop one of those last four Rams drives and they win. Instead the Rams just ran and passed all over them. That's Kyle's fault as the HC. The play calls were mostly fine. If I could swap the 3rd and 1 run for a pass and/or the 1st and 10 pass with 1:08 left for a run, sure I'd be down for those. But overall the play calls worked but were let down by specific players messing them up. The defense and special teams were both total group/scheme failures, and that's a far, far bigger issue.

When your defense sucks it's generally accepted logic to play keep away and not let them have the ball

Agree. My only thought is maybe he didn't realize his defense sucks?
Originally posted by LifelongNiner:
Originally posted by Afrikan:
Turning over the roster?

Why not let another coach take over with this roster?.. before feeling we need to start over? We've seen that happen before in this league (and other sports). A Coach only does so much with a talented roster, different guy comes in... makes most of that roster and those opportunities.

Kyle was given an cheating team these last few years... and even more so when he lucked into Christian McCaffrey.

You expect him to have a less talented roster and...somehow do better? Pfffff... nope... I ain't dealing with another 5years of Kyle rebuilding this team, JUST to stick with the same mentality that gets him to lose Super Bowls by the time we get better.

Fuuuuuck that!

Because that's just a crapshoot. That is literally what led to us getting Jim Tomsula. The reality is you are most likely going to get a coach that is worse. The better coach (Reid) ain't available. All of the other hot names (like Ben Johnson), are just that- hot names. Hot names with no long term track record of running successful offenses. You are making a change and hoping for better. Successful coaches are more likely to conitnue winning, even with different players. Kyle didn't come here with 1-2 years of success. He had demonstrated he could run good offenses in Atlanta, Washington, and Houston. Every where he went, the offenses were top notch. So I can be sure it's more him than just lucking into players. No one except for Andy Reid has that kind of pedigree and I'm not looking to do the Tomsula experiment again hoping we catch lightning in a bottle. It's a sad reality and I hate it, because it's little tweaks here or there and we are at worst a 1 time Super Bowl winner. But we have no idea how anyone else would've done.

Beyond running good offenses, we've seen he can build a good team from the absolute bottom. Damn near a juggernaut, minus the trophies. Sean McVay is trying to do that now (he had talent when he arrived in LA). Maybe he might have done a better job? But it still remains to be seen if he can build up a top team the way he has to now and even then, he still has a better head start than what Kyle had in 2017.

I expect him to consistently get us there moreso than any other coach save for Andy Reid. And even then, I wonder how Reid looks without Mahommes. We do have the Philly years to look at which seem a lot like Kyle's. And I'd argue McNabb is far better than Garoppolo.

I will say this, as far as his weaknesses go- does anyone on the staff even challenge his special team's philsophy? We know for sure Schneider doesn't, so I have no hope in that regard that special teams will ever even be average on this team. It's kind of wild for a team that invests such high draft picks in their kicker and punter, that the head coach only wants special teams to not F up.

Originally posted by mcwoot:
Originally posted by captveg:
Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

It's so annoying to see the blame on Kyle's offense. The blame Kyle deserves is on his defense and special teams. Stop one of those last four Rams drives and they win. Instead the Rams just ran and passed all over them. That's Kyle's fault as the HC. The play calls were mostly fine. If I could swap the 3rd and 1 run for a pass and/or the 1st and 10 pass with 1:08 left for a run, sure I'd be down for those. But overall the play calls worked but were let down by specific players messing them up. The defense and special teams were both total group/scheme failures, and that's a far, far bigger issue.

When your defense sucks it's generally accepted logic to play keep away and not let them have the ball

Agree. My only thought is maybe he didn't realize his defense sucks?

They tried to improve the defense by addingFloyd and Collins as well as some help in the defensive backfield. So far it's not working but Sorenson is still learning and the players are adjusting again to a new DC. Losing Hargrave is a blow not only to the starting group but the depth as well.
Originally posted by DrEll:
Originally posted by English:
Originally posted by DrEll:
Actually I'm not. That's why I expect SB or bust year in and year out. It's the young lazy fans that enjoy the "journey"…the "camaraderie"….the "effort" the team gives week in and week out. It's lame. As I've said before, EddieD would not have stood for this BS. Kyle would likely have been tossed after he lost that Rams NFCC game, giving up his second 10 point lead in the closing moments.

the Jed Yorks of this world only care about the revenue. They have the youngsters duped…

Um, I don't know how old you are, but you should be aware that Eddie DeBartolo pressured Bill Walsh out of the Niners. And very much as tossing Shanahan out now would be a massive mistake, that was a huge error too. Just because Eddie DeBartolo did it doesn't make it right.

Seifert won two SBs after Eddie D pressured Bill Walsh out. And he fired Seifert for not overcoming the Packers, despite winning 2 SBs. That is the standard our coaching staff should be held to, not "well at least he makes us competitive every year".

Absolutely.

Anything short of our standard this year, Jed needs to hold someone accountable.
Stupid Steelers not firing Tomlin for not meeting their 70s standards.
The real problem I have with him, and I'm a big fan of his, is that there are all these glaring problems (LB, WR, Secondsry) yet he refuses to make changes. Even though we have the pieces to do so. It can't get worse than Bell's drops, Csmpbell's coverage or Yidoms coverage in terms of okaying our rookies yet he continues to play them. He is too slow or stubborn to adress things quickly even though the numbers don't lie.
Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
Originally posted by LifelongNiner:
Originally posted by Afrikan:
Turning over the roster?

Why not let another coach take over with this roster?.. before feeling we need to start over? We've seen that happen before in this league (and other sports). A Coach only does so much with a talented roster, different guy comes in... makes most of that roster and those opportunities.

Kyle was given an cheating team these last few years... and even more so when he lucked into Christian McCaffrey.

You expect him to have a less talented roster and...somehow do better? Pfffff... nope... I ain't dealing with another 5years of Kyle rebuilding this team, JUST to stick with the same mentality that gets him to lose Super Bowls by the time we get better.

Fuuuuuck that!

Because that's just a crapshoot. That is literally what led to us getting Jim Tomsula. The reality is you are most likely going to get a coach that is worse. The better coach (Reid) ain't available. All of the other hot names (like Ben Johnson), are just that- hot names. Hot names with no long term track record of running successful offenses. You are making a change and hoping for better. Successful coaches are more likely to conitnue winning, even with different players. Kyle didn't come here with 1-2 years of success. He had demonstrated he could run good offenses in Atlanta, Washington, and Houston. Every where he went, the offenses were top notch. So I can be sure it's more him than just lucking into players. No one except for Andy Reid has that kind of pedigree and I'm not looking to do the Tomsula experiment again hoping we catch lightning in a bottle. It's a sad reality and I hate it, because it's little tweaks here or there and we are at worst a 1 time Super Bowl winner. But we have no idea how anyone else would've done.

Beyond running good offenses, we've seen he can build a good team from the absolute bottom. Damn near a juggernaut, minus the trophies. Sean McVay is trying to do that now (he had talent when he arrived in LA). Maybe he might have done a better job? But it still remains to be seen if he can build up a top team the way he has to now and even then, he still has a better head start than what Kyle had in 2017.

I expect him to consistently get us there moreso than any other coach save for Andy Reid. And even then, I wonder how Reid looks without Mahommes. We do have the Philly years to look at which seem a lot like Kyle's. And I'd argue McNabb is far better than Garoppolo.

I will say this, as far as his weaknesses go- does anyone on the staff even challenge his special team's philsophy? We know for sure Schneider doesn't, so I have no hope in that regard that special teams will ever even be average on this team. It's kind of wild for a team that invests such high draft picks in their kicker and punter, that the head coach only wants special teams to not F up.

Originally posted by mcwoot:
Originally posted by captveg:
Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

It's so annoying to see the blame on Kyle's offense. The blame Kyle deserves is on his defense and special teams. Stop one of those last four Rams drives and they win. Instead the Rams just ran and passed all over them. That's Kyle's fault as the HC. The play calls were mostly fine. If I could swap the 3rd and 1 run for a pass and/or the 1st and 10 pass with 1:08 left for a run, sure I'd be down for those. But overall the play calls worked but were let down by specific players messing them up. The defense and special teams were both total group/scheme failures, and that's a far, far bigger issue.

When your defense sucks it's generally accepted logic to play keep away and not let them have the ball

Agree. My only thought is maybe he didn't realize his defense sucks?

They tried to improve the defense by addingFloyd and Collins as well as some help in the defensive backfield. So far it's not working but Sorenson is still learning and the players are adjusting again to a new DC. Losing Hargrave is a blow not only to the starting group but the depth as well.

I'm actually going to give Sorensen a pass for now. I looked at the Detroit game and Green Bay games from those years and the reality is, it took Ryans more than half the season to get it together. One thing that handicaps us, in spite of available talent is that we are constantly turning over at DC- four defensive coordinators in five years.

It's gonna take him about 8 games to really get in a groove. What doomed Wilks is that he never really got into that groove unfortunately. Until then, the offense has gotta play clean football. They've gotta play ball control and go with higher percentage plays as well as players who are reliable. Smart football and ball control on offense until the defense finds it's groove with yet another playcaller should help us whether the storm and hopefully be 5-3/6-3 at worst by the midseason point (I hate the 17 game schedule ).

Losing Hargrave absolutely hurts, but hopefully the run D gets better. There's gotta be a guy we can pluck off someone's practice squad however. I'd be shocked if among 31 teams, there isn't one defensive player we can sign that can be a part of the rotation so guys can have a breather.
Originally posted by PatandBow:
Absolutely.

Anything short of our standard this year, Jed needs to hold someone accountable.

Originally posted by MBNINER90266:
The real problem I have with him, and I'm a big fan of his, is that there are all these glaring problems (LB, WR, Secondsry) yet he refuses to make changes. Even though we have the pieces to do so. It can't get worse than Bell's drops, Csmpbell's coverage or Yidoms coverage in terms of okaying our rookies yet he continues to play them. He is too slow or stubborn to adress things quickly even though the numbers don't lie.

It's 3 games.
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by MBNINER90266:
The real problem I have with him, and I'm a big fan of his, is that there are all these glaring problems (LB, WR, Secondsry) yet he refuses to make changes. Even though we have the pieces to do so. It can't get worse than Bell's drops, Csmpbell's coverage or Yidoms coverage in terms of okaying our rookies yet he continues to play them. He is too slow or stubborn to adress things quickly even though the numbers don't lie.

It's 3 games.

Yeah, 2 really bad ones. Again, look at the numbers.
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Originally posted by MBNINER90266:
The real problem I have with him, and I'm a big fan of his, is that there are all these glaring problems (LB, WR, Secondsry) yet he refuses to make changes. Even though we have the pieces to do so. It can't get worse than Bell's drops, Csmpbell's coverage or Yidoms coverage in terms of okaying our rookies yet he continues to play them. He is too slow or stubborn to adress things quickly even though the numbers don't lie.

It's 3 games.

Here you go:

https://www.nbcsportsbayarea.com/nfl/san-francisco-49ers/three-position-changes-2024-season/1786164/
Originally posted by MBNINER90266:
Here you go:

https://www.nbcsportsbayarea.com/nfl/san-francisco-49ers/three-position-changes-2024-season/1786164/

Thing is Winters was terrible in preseason. So you are making a change to make a change. If anything Robinson should be the wlb with Warner.
Originally posted by 9ers4eva:
Originally posted by MBNINER90266:
Here you go:

https://www.nbcsportsbayarea.com/nfl/san-francisco-49ers/three-position-changes-2024-season/1786164/

Thing is Winters was terrible in preseason. So you are making a change to make a change. If anything Robinson should be the wlb with Warner.

How dare you question the opinion of a journalist and a random person on a forum board. They clearly know more than the coach who's gotten to multiple Super Bowls.
I am not at all down with firing KS. But I might be ready to fire everyone else, except Turner.
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