49ers Head Coach Kyle Shanahan Thread

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by Bringbackedjr:
If we end up with a losing record this year and follow it up with a poor start next year does your opinion change? At what point would you agree with a change in leadership? This year is spiraling out of control… it just looks and feels wrong. They are not digging out of it this time. I am asking you what is your threshold for a change. Two years of losing? 3 years?

There's so much context that goes with that. If Brock gets hurt and we have to play Allen all yr, does that mean Kyle needs to be fired? You really think this team is gonna just fold and get their ass kicked every week?

I'm assuming you said the same thing in 2021 when they were 2-4 this time or when they lost 3 straight this time last yr? You act like they're getting their ass kicked every week when in reality they're a couple plays away from being 4-1 right now.

Assume Brock stays upright. Also if he plays Allen over dobbs he should fired on the spot for stupidity but that's a different discussion. I just want to know your threshold. What will it take? For me it's two years of underperforming. This year and next. What is it for you? Qualify your answer anyway you want.

Originally posted by MucketyMuck:

This is where I'm at. There's no other replacement and I really don't want a replacement as Kyle is an offensive genius but his problem, and it's a massive problem is his inability to not completely fall apart at the the most crucial times. He's a choker... That is his main problem.

It comes from a lack of preparation. He's not sure what call to make. He didn't look into the strategy behind an ot where both teams get possession. Guys like Walsh and Belichick already knew the best move before the moment came. They obsessed over that s**t

Originally posted by MucketyMuck:

Originally posted by CharlieSheen:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
And how many years does this new regime get to win it all? How long are they allowed to lose a couple games in a row before the mob starts up again?

folks want to take two steps back in hopes that it's 4 steps forward…but there's absolutely no chance they give that new regime yrs to build their team and go through growing pains….not after going to SBs and constant playoffs games.

Folks can't even name a legit candidate that would do better than Kyle. IMO the same people wanting him fired are the same fans that think firing their HC every couple yrs will magically change it all. Like we have it bad here here and aren't in contention for division titles, playoff games, NFCC games and SB games currently

I don't want him fired, I'm just rightfully frustrated as all fans should be. I know we can't let a top 3 offensive mind in the game out of the building, but sometimes I wish we had him in a coordinator or quality control role with someone else handling hc duties. Especially after 7 years with no change

This is where I'm at. There's no other replacement and I really don't want a replacement as Kyle is an offensive genius but his problem, and it's a massive problem is his inability to not completely fall apart at the the most crucial times. He's a choker... That is his main problem.

A true genius does not have his team ranked 30th for red zone efficiency. Not with all the weapons we have.

Originally posted by DaleGribble:

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by DaleGribble:
So we've went from can't name a legitimate candidate to can't name a legitimate candidate who would do better as if either is even relevant to the conversation.

By the way who gets to determine whether or not the candidate is legitimate?

Never said no one is allowed to say someone…I said for all the b***hing going on no one has legit plan or thought of who should replace him….and yes why do they think the candidate would be better?

only name I've heard at any point is Bill Belichick. We all saw how he was without Brady

I'd say the whole forum gets to decide if that candidate is a legitimate answer or not and why.

Anyone one can complain about a coach but as you point out I've haven't seen any post with a legitimate suggestion for who could replace him. There are only a couple of coaches in the NFL that are on Kyle's level and they're locked up. Bringing in a coordinator as HC is a total crapshoot. College coaches are also a big if.

Throwing names off possible replacements out there doesn't invalidate legitimate criticisms of Shannahan in an way shape or form it's irrelevant.

Lol the funniest part of this is you guys expecting some plug and play guaranteed upgrade to shanahan.

That's not how coaching hires work most of the time. We don't have the luxury of just replacing shanahan with mcvay, or Reid, or Tomlin. There's no automatic upgrade most of the time.

You have to take a chance on change and hope it gets better.

The most amazing thing is in this case and prior to this year you had as close a guarantee as you possibly could with bellicheat and harbaugh available. Now it's just down to bill, but people want to say ohhh none of those SBS count because he had Brady. He sucks as a coach....

There is no reason to fire shanahan. He's worth a ton as a trade asset. Just like the 30% left of fans who still think he's the Messiah there are teams that think the same thing and will give up a ton to let him choke in the playoffs for them ...

Bill makes the most sense because you can easily save face and hire him due to his resume and trade shanahan. No justification needed for the Yorks. Anyone else you have to hope they are going to blossom into a great coach because they don't have the resume yet.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by socalfan21:
The dude has gone to the NFC championship 4 times and hasn't won a super bowl. 3/4 of those season ending games, he had a 10 point plus lead. That is the definition of a choker.

Two of those NFCCs we had broken QBs. One lasted a series.

so if he wins on of those 4 chances, he's all of a sudden not a choker lol? One fumble recovery changes a game and he's not a choker all of a sudden?

So are Doug Peterson and Mike McCartney not chokers? Is Tomlin, John Harbs, Payton not chokers because they won a SB over a decade ago? Anything after that is meaningless? Jim is a choker apparently, no?

what about the 80% of HCs that never sniff a SB game? Are they all chokers?

Again have some perspective when looking at the league as a whole.

The choker label to me is in reference to someone who has history of coming up short in big situations so that would exclude SB winning coaches no matter how recently that win occurred, aswell as coaches that have lost a single SB.

Originally posted by CharlieSheen:
What's sad is if Feliciano and Burford stayed healthy through the preseason I doubt Puni would be getting any run. I agree his personnel decisions is another area that is starting to cost him too

I mean Deebo, Warner, kittle all started as rookies. burford started as a rookie.

Originally posted by Bringbackedjr:
Assume Brock stays upright. Also if he plays Allen over dobbs he should fired on the spot for stupidity but that's a different discussion. I just want to know your threshold. What will it take? For me it's two years of underperforming. This year and next. What is it for you? Qualify your answer anyway you want.

I don't know what it will take because I don't live in absolutes.

what's underperforming? Not winning a SB?

Originally posted by BoldRedandGold:

Originally posted by DaleGribble:

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by DaleGribble:
So we've went from can't name a legitimate candidate to can't name a legitimate candidate who would do better as if either is even relevant to the conversation.

By the way who gets to determine whether or not the candidate is legitimate?

Never said no one is allowed to say someone…I said for all the b***hing going on no one has legit plan or thought of who should replace him….and yes why do they think the candidate would be better?

only name I've heard at any point is Bill Belichick. We all saw how he was without Brady

I'd say the whole forum gets to decide if that candidate is a legitimate answer or not and why.

Anyone one can complain about a coach but as you point out I've haven't seen any post with a legitimate suggestion for who could replace him. There are only a couple of coaches in the NFL that are on Kyle's level and they're locked up. Bringing in a coordinator as HC is a total crapshoot. College coaches are also a big if.

Throwing names off possible replacements out there doesn't invalidate legitimate criticisms of Shannahan in an way shape or form it's irrelevant.

Lol the funniest part of this is you guys expecting some plug and play guaranteed upgrade to shanahan.

That's not how coaching hires work most of the time. We don't have the luxury of just replacing shanahan with mcvay, or Reid, or Tomlin. There's no automatic upgrade most of the time.

You have to take a chance on change and hope it gets better.

The most amazing thing is in this case and prior to this year you had as close a guarantee as you possibly could with bellicheat and harbaugh available. Now it's just down to bill, but people want to say ohhh none of those SBS count because he had Brady. He sucks as a coach....

There is no reason to fire shanahan. He's worth a ton as a trade asset. Just like the 30% left of fans who still think he's the Messiah there are teams that think the same thing and will give up a ton to let him choke in the playoffs for them ...

Bill makes the most sense because you can easily save face and hire him due to his resume and trade shanahan. No justification needed for the Yorks. Anyone else you have to hope they are going to blossom into a great coach because they don't have the resume yet.

Where did I say I expected a plug & play upgrade to Shannahan?

I've never even said he should be replaced but what I find to be the funniest part is that people think the only alternative to Shannahan is the end of days.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by Bringbackedjr:
Assume Brock stays upright. Also if he plays Allen over dobbs he should fired on the spot for stupidity but that's a different discussion. I just want to know your threshold. What will it take? For me it's two years of underperforming. This year and next. What is it for you? Qualify your answer anyway you want.

I don't know what it will take because I don't live in absolutes.

what's underperforming? Not winning a SB?

You wouldn't consider not winning a SB with the best roster in football underperforming?

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by CharlieSheen:

What's sad is if Feliciano and Burford stayed healthy through the preseason I doubt Puni would be getting any run. I agree his personnel decisions is another area that is starting to cost him too

I mean Deebo, Warner, kittle all started as rookies. burford started as a rookie.

Yea it's a really low number for a 7 year regime, but not playing rookies over s**t vet signings is not his only personnel problem

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by Bringbackedjr:
Assume Brock stays upright. Also if he plays Allen over dobbs he should fired on the spot for stupidity but that's a different discussion. I just want to know your threshold. What will it take? For me it's two years of underperforming. This year and next. What is it for you? Qualify your answer anyway you want.

I don't know what it will take because I don't live in absolutes.

what's underperforming? Not winning a SB?

A non answer when given the opportunity to qualify your response tells me you either have no threshold or you simply love arguing with fans who have legitimate concerns with the direction we are headed.

Originally posted by DaleGribble:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by Bringbackedjr:
Assume Brock stays upright. Also if he plays Allen over dobbs he should fired on the spot for stupidity but that's a different discussion. I just want to know your threshold. What will it take? For me it's two years of underperforming. This year and next. What is it for you? Qualify your answer anyway you want.

I don't know what it will take because I don't live in absolutes.

what's underperforming? Not winning a SB?

You wouldn't consider not winning a SB with the best roster in football underperforming?

No cause its tough to win a Super Bowl, not to mention consistently making the playoffs is tough as it is. But you act like Shanahan is suppose to win the Super Bowl every year with this roster.

Originally posted by CharlieSheen:

Originally posted by MucketyMuck:
This is where I'm at. There's no other replacement and I really don't want a replacement as Kyle is an offensive genius but his problem, and it's a massive problem is his inability to not completely fall apart at the the most crucial times. He's a choker... That is his main problem.

It comes from a lack of preparation. He's not sure what call to make. He didn't look into the strategy behind an ot where both teams get possession. Guys like Walsh and Belichick already knew the best move before the moment came. They obsessed over that s**t

Exactly. Just some examples from recent weeks. We play Minnesota down by 3 inside the 5. Tough defense on the road most coaches take the 3. Kyle goes for it and fails. Fast forward to this last week. Multiple opportunities inside the red zone inside the 10. Any one of those is a TD and the nail is in the coffin. Kyle plays it conservative every time.

Flip to the other side. Zona's coach get the ball at the one after roughing a passer call. What does he do ? He gets aggressive and goes for two. We all know that no way in that same position does Kyle attempt to go for two. We could be at the 6 inch line and he would still opt for 3 saying that he wouldn't want risk not getting it then needing a TD later.

He doesn't have coaching instincts. He's just a very good OC and even with that title he get lost in crunch time because he doesn't improvise outside of his playbook.

Originally posted by DaleGribble:
The choker label to me is in reference to someone who has history of coming up short in big situations so that would exclude SB winning coaches no matter how recently that win occurred, aswell as coaches that have lost a single SB.

So Peterson is not a choker? He's about to be fired but he doesn't choke ever…because he won one game lol.

mike McCarthy/Payton got gifted two of the best QBs of all-time and squeaked out one SB and nothing else with over a decade of playing together? Tomlin won a SB once over 15 yrs ago with someone else's team and then nothing…Man either they massively underperformed as a HC OR winning a SB is really f**king hard.

so if you make it the SB once and never make it back…how are you not a choker? All you're doing is choking so bad you can't even make it to the big game and then when you do get there….nothing.

you either win it all or you're a choker that year…putting all these stipulations on who can and can't be labeled a choker is ridiculous.

Originally posted by Bringbackedjr:
A non answer when given the opportunity to qualify your response tells me you either have no threshold or you simply love arguing with fans who have legitimate concerns with the direction we are headed.

No it's because there's layers to all of it…it's not a black and white thing which is the problem with a lot of you and your debate on this.

I'm sure you were chicken little this time last yr when they lost 3 in a row