2017 Training Camp Thread

Originally posted by Fanaticofnfl:

I am very, very cautiously optimistic.

I prefer unrealistically optimistic this time of year.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Cohn:

THE NOT SO GOOD

1. The pass defense. This has become the team's biggest weakness. Today, the pass defense gave up 38 catches on 56 pass attempts – a completion percentage of 67.9. And the defense had a particularly difficult time defending play action. Most of the time when the offense used a run fake, at least one wide receiver would end up wide open. This pass defense could be one of the worst in the league.

So Kyle notes the offense won on yards but the defense won in the RZ only giving up 1 TD. And we really only had Johnson and Reid out there. Ward, Robinson, Reaser, out... playing with Lorenzo and James and Witherspoon, who's clearly not ready yet.

In short, our secondary SHOULD look shaky right now. It was also first team vs. second and vice versa.

The pass rushing is there. Almost every play they were right there with qb but then eased up or ran by the qb

Originally posted by Memphis9er:

Originally posted by ChazBoner:

Originally posted by jcs:

Originally posted by Joecool:

Me thinks Kyle used the fan day to prop up the offense a little for some cheers and entertainment which is why the last two practices were so grueling.

#forthefans

Lets not forget this D was ranked as the worst in the league last year and this roster is now learning a new system with a rookie DC. I expect them to be better but I don't expect a miracle.

Worst run defense in the HISTORY of the NFL.

Jeddy boi setting records

Yeah man, shame on York for not having his nerdy ass out there making tackles.

s**t rolls down hill..

Arrogance can be blinding and the costs can outweigh the benefits of being an arrogant dirtbag if there are any benefits.

I hope he has learned his lesson.

Originally posted by Joecool:

Don't lie. What you want more than anything is for us to kick ass and go 12-4.

My prediction is 4-12

So I see our over payed under achieving linebacker we signed to be a game changer,, yes you pay someone that much and you expect them to be game changer . is out for the year. lol. anyone care to tell me how they are not worried and how we are going to have a top 15 defense?

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Cohn:

THE NOT SO GOOD

1. The pass defense. This has become the team's biggest weakness. Today, the pass defense gave up 38 catches on 56 pass attempts – a completion percentage of 67.9. And the defense had a particularly difficult time defending play action. Most of the time when the offense used a run fake, at least one wide receiver would end up wide open. This pass defense could be one of the worst in the league.

So Kyle notes the offense won on yards but the defense won in the RZ only giving up 1 TD. And we really only had Johnson and Reid out there. Ward, Robinson, Reaser, out... playing with Lorenzo and James and Witherspoon, who's clearly not ready yet.

In short, our secondary SHOULD look shaky right now. It was also first team vs. second and vice versa.

The pass rushing is there. Almost every play they were right there with qb but then eased up or ran by the qb

True but I was referencing Cohn's point here. Kyle noted that several plays would have been sacks but they are unstructured to carry out the plays so the offense gets the work.

Originally posted by cciowa:

So I see our over payed under achieving linebacker we signed to be a game changer,, yes you pay someone that much and you expect them to be game changer . is out for the year. lol. anyone care to tell me how they are not worried and how we are going to have a top 15 defense?

There's nothing good so far. 4 guys will hit I.R. already (Garnett might be a designation for return) and a truck load more nursing less serious injuries.

The only bright side is that the two guys behind him (Ray-Ray & Foster) are much better cover LB's and will be doing just that up to 70% of the time in nickel.

Ray-Ray was our original stater last year before he got hurt himself. He and Foster were already the "starters" in nickel. He can play.

But we did lose a ton of chemistry between Smith and Bowman growing together and Smith, clearly, knows every intricate detail of this defense.

Foster will now be competing with Ray-Ray to start.

Originally posted by cciowa:

So I see our over payed under achieving linebacker we signed to be a game changer,, yes you pay someone that much and you expect them to be game changer . is out for the year. lol. anyone care to tell me how they are not worried and how we are going to have a top 15 defense?

1. I dont think anyone had very high expectations from him.

2. We drafted Rueben Foster.

3. We have 1 billlion in cap space.

4. We are in year 1 of a rebuild

5. We aren't playoff contenders

So no i'm not worried at all.

Originally posted by miked1978:

Originally posted by cciowa:

So I see our over payed under achieving linebacker we signed to be a game changer,, yes you pay someone that much and you expect them to be game changer . is out for the year. lol. anyone care to tell me how they are not worried and how we are going to have a top 15 defense?

1. I dont think anyone had very high expectations from him.

2. We drafted Rueben Foster.

3. We have 1 billlion in cap space.

4. We are in year 1 of a rebuild

5. We aren't playoff contenders

So no i'm not worried at all.

Really wanted to see smith back in this defense but yea, not worried for the rest of your reasons. I know we are talking about real people with families and all but the best possible outcome is another top 3 pick next year so one way or another that's kinda what I want.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Cohn:

THE NOT SO GOOD

1. The pass defense. This has become the team's biggest weakness. Today, the pass defense gave up 38 catches on 56 pass attempts – a completion percentage of 67.9. And the defense had a particularly difficult time defending play action. Most of the time when the offense used a run fake, at least one wide receiver would end up wide open. This pass defense could be one of the worst in the league.

So Kyle notes the offense won on yards but the defense won in the RZ only giving up 1 TD. And we really only had Johnson and Reid out there. Ward, Robinson, Reaser, out... playing with Lorenzo and James and Witherspoon, who's clearly not ready yet.

In short, our secondary SHOULD look shaky right now. It was also first team vs. second and vice versa.

And I was concerned about our DBs BEFORE the injury plague hit. No idea what these guys could do, but now there are fewer of them to worry about. Unhhh...that doesn't sound too good either. I'll try again later.

Originally posted by NCommand:
Cohn:

THE NOT SO GOOD

1. The pass defense. This has become the team's biggest weakness. Today, the pass defense gave up 38 catches on 56 pass attempts – a completion percentage of 67.9. And the defense had a particularly difficult time defending play action. Most of the time when the offense used a run fake, at least one wide receiver would end up wide open. This pass defense could be one of the worst in the league.

So Kyle notes the offense won on yards but the defense won in the RZ only giving up 1 TD. And we really only had Johnson and Reid out there. Ward, Robinson, Reaser, out... playing with Lorenzo and James and Witherspoon, who's clearly not ready yet.

In short, our secondary SHOULD look shaky right now. It was also first team vs. second and vice versa.

Have to consider the source...
How can you really examine the execution of players in practice when you're so busy writing down catches and pass attempts while calculating completion percentages? That said, I seriously doubt the accuracy of those calculations.

Can't wait to see this team on Friday night in Kansas City. Hopefully we can get healthy before the game Friday night!

General note on "clean outs" of knees... supposedly is what the Josh Garnett problem is, assuming whoever released the report had actual and factual data. I'm not an expert in this but after 16 knee surgeries, including 6 total knee replacements (that means some failed), there were 8 that were regarded as "clean outs". Usually that means broken cartilage, or a broken off piece of cartilage is floating around in the knee joint. A teeny tiny fragment of cartilage, (fibrocartilage is body's response to cartilage injury with scar formation), and this can impede knee movement if a tiny piece of cartilage breaks off or a piece of fibrocartilage breaks free.) This can be a very small procedure, but does not mean that whatever the initial injury was, that it too was involved...it may not be. So if Garnett has some debris floating around in the joint space, it could be a very easy fix...scope goes in, finds floating debris, scope comes out and procedure over. Patient up and moving around almost immediatley . Not playing immediately, but up an around. But it also could mean the injury that started all this is inflamed, involved, and needs removal of scar buildup (fibrocartilage) around the injured site . This would NOT be so simple as for recovery time.

This could truly be a very minor thing, but i was unaware of previous knee problems in Garnett. The fact kyle is expecting his return sometime during the season sounds like this is just a clean out of debris. If once they get in there and see that a previous injury is now a mass of fibrocartilage, then that has to be removed, If cartilage itself has been broken and come loose, that can be removed easily. It is what remains that is the concern.

Reid just returned from an ankle, Tartt out with ribs, Ward out with a hamstring and Robinson with a hamstring too.

I wouldn't play any of these guys this Friday.

Let Reaser (knee) and Johnson play outside and Lorenzo and James play to see what we've got with those two.

I'd consider not playing Williams either and let Redmond play all the spots.

Tough call on what to do with the MIKE and WILL linebackers.