The Iron-Pyrite-Lining Thread (Negative people come on in!)

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by NinerSickness:
I don't think he knows what he's doing. I think he's playing it safe with his personnel moves, and I think that's the best way to not win a SB. I think in 5 years, we're going to look back at the lynch era like we look back at post-Young, the Steve Mariucci era. He'll probably get to the playoffs a time or 2, but he'll have zero chance to win it all.

He's an amateur. And time will prove me right, unfortunately (unless the team gets lucky with a disastrous 2017, and they get a top-3 pick).

Playing it safe? He helped bring in like 50 new players lol. He was able to help get us two first rd picks along with two top 100 picks for the next yr.

Yes, he's playing it safe. New doesn't equal riskier. Paying huge money to a guy like Garcon is playing it safe because he's an amateur who doesn't know how to identify WR talent. He could have paid more money & gotten a better, younger WR long-term like Terrelle Pryor, but he went with a "meh" WR who's already 30 because he's playing for the short term. Higher floor; lower ceiling.

Kirk Cousins notwithstanding.

Originally posted by NinerSickness:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by NinerSickness:

I don't think he knows what he's doing. I think he's playing it safe with his personnel moves, and I think that's the best way to not win a SB. I think in 5 years, we're going to look back at the lynch era like we look back at post-Young, the Steve Mariucci era. He'll probably get to the playoffs a time or 2, but he'll have zero chance to win it all.

He's an amateur. And time will prove me right, unfortunately (unless the team gets lucky with a disastrous 2017, and they get a top-3 pick).

Playing it safe? He helped bring in like 50 new players lol. He was able to help get us two first rd picks along with two top 100 picks for the next yr.

Yes, he's playing it safe. New doesn't equal riskier. Paying huge money to a guy like Garcon is playing it safe because he's an amateur who doesn't know how to identify WR talent. He could have paid more money & gotten a better, younger WR long-term like Terrelle Pryor, but he went with a "meh" WR who's already 30 because he's playing for the short term. Higher floor; lower ceiling.

Kirk Cousins notwithstanding.

Your football knowledge is sickening

Originally posted by NinerSickness:
Yes, he's playing it safe. New doesn't equal riskier. Paying huge money to a guy like Garcon is playing it safe because he's an amateur who doesn't know how to identify WR talent. He could have paid more money & gotten a better, younger WR long-term like Terrelle Pryor, but he went with a "meh" WR who's already 30 because he's playing for the short term. Higher floor; lower ceiling.

Kirk Cousins notwithstanding.

what a baloney comment.

There's a difference between playing it safe and being smart. We're one of the youngest teams in the league and can use a smart/good vet WR that just came off a 1,000 yard season....oh wait he knows the system too? BONUS

You can't just grab whomever you want in FA either, the player needs to want to come there as well. Garcon wanted to play for Kyle.

Pryor was such a coveted FA that he got what a one yr deal? you can't have a team full of JUST 20 something players.

Also what the f**k is wrong with being 30?? Seriously? Garcon's game is based around crisp route-running and playing smart tough football. IF he drops off a cliff they can move on from him after 2018 his contract is far from some back breaking HUGE contract.

you should have renamed this thread...they didn't run the team how I would so THEY are wrong lol.

Originally posted by NinerSickness:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by NinerSickness:
I don't think he knows what he's doing. I think he's playing it safe with his personnel moves, and I think that's the best way to not win a SB. I think in 5 years, we're going to look back at the lynch era like we look back at post-Young, the Steve Mariucci era. He'll probably get to the playoffs a time or 2, but he'll have zero chance to win it all.

He's an amateur. And time will prove me right, unfortunately (unless the team gets lucky with a disastrous 2017, and they get a top-3 pick).

Playing it safe? He helped bring in like 50 new players lol. He was able to help get us two first rd picks along with two top 100 picks for the next yr.

Yes, he's playing it safe. New doesn't equal riskier. Paying huge money to a guy like Garcon is playing it safe because he's an amateur who doesn't know how to identify WR talent. He could have paid more money & gotten a better, younger WR long-term like Terrelle Pryor, but he went with a "meh" WR who's already 30 because he's playing for the short term. Higher floor; lower ceiling.

Kirk Cousins notwithstanding.

Seems the rest of the WR needy teams played it safe too considering Pryor ended up with a 1 year 6 million dollar deal. There are 29 other WR's who are making more money than Pryor this year. Pryor had interest from a handful of teams but the market did not agree with his initial asking price and he was forced to settle for a prove it deal at this stage.

Lynch did not play it safe, he played it smart. He and Kyle began to rebuild and reshape this roster to fit their vision, and they needed to start with creating a foundation to build up off of. Rome was not built in a day nor were any dynasties, if you want to build a long term contender you get the pieces that fit your vision. Just because your vision is not the same as their vision does not mean they are making mistakes, there is more than one way to skin a cat.

Sickness, i am a bit puzzled about your concerns. I, like many, NY included, were stunned when Lynch was announced as GM. Came out of nowhere. But instead of cherry picking a couple players where he COULD have done better, like Prior instead of Garcon, or either of your other two examples, what has he done?

Well, you must have noted that we no longer have the yorks making day to day football decisions. What did the yorks do? They or Jed hired Lynch to come in and both quietly and secretly trouble shoot the team and entire 49er organization. Lynch also said if one word got out about it, he was gone. This is the same guy who Elway convinced to come along for the ride and sit in on the workings of a great Bronco organization, top to bottom. So it isn't like he was broadcasting one day and GM the next. There was a lot of learning right at the side of one of football's greats, John Elway...who turned out to be quite a GM /management guy himself.

So he looked at everything, and we were bad everywhere, field to office to front office...up to and including ownership. So jed et al agreed, and what did we get?

Well we got the consensus best OC for our OC/HC. No question there.

We got the best draft preparation in memory, and it was a joint effort...it was also secret as hell...a definite first for the york 49ers. One guy with sterling QB and OC credentials, and the other with great football insight and a SB Ring on the D side.

We got rid of chip already, and baalke had overstayed his usefulness by about 4+ yrs, maybe longer. NOw both long gone.

Made the decision in a non FR QB yr with truly iffy potential FR QB material at an all time low....to NOT take a FR QB in draft in that there was none there. And on top of that:

Somehow swapped with CHI for our #2 and they take Trubs, turning down Solomon , and giving us a 3rd and a 4th...one of which later was used to get us a developmental QB, CJ, the only guy kyle had any interest in. Note, nobody had heard peep one about this beforehand. Maybe it was 3 picks too early, but sensing someone else might be taking CJ, kyle asked to move up 3 slots(or 4) into end of rd 3 from 2nd pick in rd 4. Not a big deal and it used up one of the extra picks from CHI. But we finally got a developmental QB on the team after baalke never having had one in any recent memory.

Then with the one extra pick traded up into 2018 for a 2nd and 3rd rd extra pick...nice if we go into 2018 offseason still needing a FR QB. All very positive so far.

Then the stunner. AFter offering CHI Solly, we take him wiht pick #3. Unbelievable. At least to me and a lot of others...esp around the NFL.

Then at pick 31 at end of rd 1 we somehow take Foster, the #1 LB in college draft. Now we have not only the best DL from the draft we have the best LB.

With 3rd pick we nail down a talented CB, who right now is all ??? But he sure could play in college. This one is TBD later. But a quality pick nonetheless. i had no better pick at a slot we needed to upgrade.

Next is small move up to ensure we have at least ONE developmental QB in pike, CJ. So what if we blew an extra pick Lynch had coaxed out of CHI in rd 1. We HAD to have at least ONE developmental QB in line, after none for yrs. Total screw up by baalke..Oh, that's right we had one last yr, but he went to practice squad and was snatched next day. That was total crap. Lynch made dang sure we had ONE in hand. So late 3rd rd + an extra pick in the bag...good move...especially now that we have seen some of CJ.

Then we add a likely alternate #1 RB to share carries with Carlos...who is in his last contract yr, and average shelf life or RBs is 4-5 yrs. Smart move great pick.

Later we add DJ, who showed at 310 lbs to be lite on his feet and agile, esp in cones at combine. Excellent later pick. The remainder of draft and some of FA get more DL, DBs, OL (especially Gillimam a swing OT from SEA who can play either side...way better backup than what we had.). You mentioned Garcon, and you are so so on him, and sure, maybe Prior is better. Big deal..one guy. We rightfully kept our ace, slot, Kerley, but draft and FA got a basket full of new blood at WR, which badly needed doing. We got rid of 4 or 5 WRs who had just been hanging around, on and off IR, and no production. Their leaving was a BIG deal. Baalke was somehow stuck to them. Now all gone and new blood in place... our WRs were absolute krapt...now gone. Maybe you liked some better but at least we got rid of guys who produced nothing. Good moves. We'll see how these WRs do. Also we decided NOT to go for a #1 WR in draft, because we could fill so many other holes instead of taking a #1 WR.

Of all their moves, this is the one i liked best...postponing #1 WR and postponing FR QB also. Sure I wanted one of the top 3 WRs, but we needed too much else first, and Lynch made the right choice for the vast betterment of the team.

We get our #1 WR in 2018. Meantime we have settled the OL from Tackle to Tackle, wth 4 nice rotational guys who can also play, and we finally got rid of the infamous devey, Martin and pears. UGH.

We also have now the best college DL from last yrs draft in DeFo (baalke), and then the best college DL in Solomon, and paired with best college LB Reuben. Suddenly our front 7 is starting to look professional, with top flite talent. AA(baalke) is back with a new shoulder. Lynch has put together a fine looking front 7. Dooms, DJ, Mitchell, Pita...all excellent picks or acquisitions.

RBs..just doubled our starting RB. And then added a piece we should have had all along, FB. We got the best out there in Jusczyk...but as a receiver and blocker.

WRs...already mentioned but best idea was getting rid of all the dead wood. We'll see how this plays out. I think next yr we spend more effort here.

TEs...got a couple with great potential, but right now that's all it is.

DBs...Spoon addition. Again, have to wait on these guys to see.

Overall, Sickness, we went from the worst talent in the league to an excellent front 7 , a great OL, great OW/FB, finally a developmental QB, we got rid of two lames from last two yrs at QB, and replaced them with a guy who has played for kyle and knows the WCO...great acquisiton. Plus a backup. That was their first move...right after firing our Trainer who had averaged 20 guys on IR the last 3 seasons.

Sickness, i could keep going, but i submit to you, that is one helluva FA and draft, plus other major moves (eg, trainer..had to be done). Also the big one:

Getting the yorks out of the managing of the team and giving controls over to football people. Now they may not be the people YOU wanted, but dang it, they are WAY WAY better Than the yorks. No more Singletary, Noln, erickson, chip, tomsul, baalke. That was all york pick stuff and it failed. Now we have professionals. The fact that you don't like them or the couple picks you named for WRs , doesn't diminish the quality of the improvements that have been made.

I personally felt we would not get out of the cellar until the team was sold. I was wrong. Lynch took over football ops (with plenty of backup....really good people) and we didn't ahve to wait fo the team to sell from the yorks to some Silicon Valley billionaire. This was way better. Oh, and now you see guys from the glory days hanging around campus. That is a small deal but means a lot to players, coaches, and fans.

So cheer up Sickness....everybody else is happy but you. Look at what's changed and we jsut went from awful to really talented in spots to very hopeful . Before LYnch and kyle arrived...we had no hope. And that is the God honest truth. Now we have hope and are able to rejoin the league. Last 17 yrs we have been a joke with a brief interlude of two yrs while harbaw was here, but he couldn't seal the deal. Lastly , our biggest concern, FR QB.

1. Kyle has great rapport with Cousins...and cousins has said he would like to play here. He signed no LT contract so this is still in the works ...a distinct possibility.
2. we have CJ, our first developmental Qb in so many yrs i can't remember the last one. And we will continue to acquire one per yr
3.we are greatly improved at qB just by virtue of our last two guys being gone. PlUS we got Kyle's guy, Hoyer , who can run the WCO while we look for the FR QB
3a. Got a backup also.
4. Got plenty of money for FR QB next yr,
5 .Got extra 2nd rd and 3rd rd picks for part of package to move up when our draft slot moves to mid pack, eg 16. We got money and picks to help us get a FR qb if kyle sees one who qualifies.

Now you tell me, Sickness, how much more did lynch have to do to make you happy? A couple different WRs? B.S. He and kyle have just done 2yrs of rebuild in 5 short months. That is what we should be focusing on.Not a couple of WRs we didn't get.

Are we done? Heck no. Still got the two big ones, FR QB and #1 WR to go. But at least when we do get them, and we will, they have a team, not a cesspool to come to. FR QB are much more likely to come here now with talent in lots of spots, esp OL and D. The psychology of that was well thot out. No FR QB now is going to look at SF as a "do not enter " zone. NOW, right now ,we look like a good team to want to come to. Six months ago...we definitely were not.

Yes, this is way long. But i am sick and tired of people grousing or complaining about the NEW, when the OLD is no further away than last yr . And if you or anyone else doesn't consider that, then i respectfully suggest you think it thru once again.

Dbl

Paso, as always, great post, informative, direct and the same optimism i feel. We still got work to do, but i love how we set ourselves up for getting a qb next year.. unless Beathard plays like i think he can.

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
Sickness, i am a bit puzzled about your concerns. I, like many, NY included, were stunned when Lynch was announced as GM. Came out of nowhere. But instead of cherry picking a couple players where he COULD have done better, like Prior instead of Garcon, or either of your other two examples, what has he done?

Well, you must have noted that we no longer have the yorks making day to day football decisions. What did the yorks do? They or Jed hired Lynch to come in and both quietly and secretly trouble shoot the team and entire 49er organization. Lynch also said if one word got out about it, he was gone. This is the same guy who Elway convinced to come along for the ride and sit in on the workings of a great Bronco organization, top to bottom. So it isn't like he was broadcasting one day and GM the next. There was a lot of learning right at the side of one of football's greats, John Elway...who turned out to be quite a GM /management guy himself.

So he looked at everything, and we were bad everywhere, field to office to front office...up to and including ownership. So jed et al agreed, and what did we get?

Well we got the consensus best OC for our OC/HC. No question there.

We got the best draft preparation in memory, and it was a joint effort...it was also secret as hell...a definite first for the york 49ers. One guy with sterling QB and OC credentials, and the other with great football insight and a SB Ring on the D side.

We got rid of chip already, and baalke had overstayed his usefulness by about 4+ yrs, maybe longer. NOw both long gone.

Made the decision in a non FR QB yr with truly iffy potential FR QB material at an all time low....to NOT take a FR QB in draft in that there was none there. And on top of that:

Somehow swapped with CHI for our #2 and they take Trubs, turning down Solomon , and giving us a 3rd and a 4th...one of which later was used to get us a developmental QB, CJ, the only guy kyle had any interest in. Note, nobody had heard peep one about this beforehand. Maybe it was 3 picks too early, but sensing someone else might be taking CJ, kyle asked to move up 3 slots(or 4) into end of rd 3 from 2nd pick in rd 4. Not a big deal and it used up one of the extra picks from CHI. But we finally got a developmental QB on the team after baalke never having had one in any recent memory.

Then with the one extra pick traded up into 2018 for a 2nd and 3rd rd extra pick...nice if we go into 2018 offseason still needing a FR QB. All very positive so far.

Then the stunner. AFter offering CHI Solly, we take him wiht pick #3. Unbelievable. At least to me and a lot of others...esp around the NFL.

Then at pick 31 at end of rd 1 we somehow take Foster, the #1 LB in college draft. Now we have not only the best DL from the draft we have the best LB.

With 3rd pick we nail down a talented CB, who right now is all ??? But he sure could play in college. This one is TBD later. But a quality pick nonetheless. i had no better pick at a slot we needed to upgrade.

Next is small move up to ensure we have at least ONE developmental QB in pike, CJ. So what if we blew an extra pick Lynch had coaxed out of CHI in rd 1. We HAD to have at least ONE developmental QB in line, after none for yrs. Total screw up by baalke..Oh, that's right we had one last yr, but he went to practice squad and was snatched next day. That was total crap. Lynch made dang sure we had ONE in hand. So late 3rd rd + an extra pick in the bag...good move...especially now that we have seen some of CJ.

Then we add a likely alternate #1 RB to share carries with Carlos...who is in his last contract yr, and average shelf life or RBs is 4-5 yrs. Smart move great pick.

Later we add DJ, who showed at 310 lbs to be lite on his feet and agile, esp in cones at combine. Excellent later pick. The remainder of draft and some of FA get more DL, DBs, OL (especially Gillimam a swing OT from SEA who can play either side...way better backup than what we had.). You mentioned Garcon, and you are so so on him, and sure, maybe Prior is better. Big deal..one guy. We rightfully kept our ace, slot, Kerley, but draft and FA got a basket full of new blood at WR, which badly needed doing. We got rid of 4 or 5 WRs who had just been hanging around, on and off IR, and no production. Their leaving was a BIG deal. Baalke was somehow stuck to them. Now all gone and new blood in place... our WRs were absolute krapt...now gone. Maybe you liked some better but at least we got rid of guys who produced nothing. Good moves. We'll see how these WRs do. Also we decided NOT to go for a #1 WR in draft, because we could fill so many other holes instead of taking a #1 WR.

Of all their moves, this is the one i liked best...postponing #1 WR and postponing FR QB also. Sure I wanted one of the top 3 WRs, but we needed too much else first, and Lynch made the right choice for the vast betterment of the team.

We get our #1 WR in 2018. Meantime we have settled the OL from Tackle to Tackle, wth 4 nice rotational guys who can also play, and we finally got rid of the infamous devey, Martin and pears. UGH.

We also have now the best college DL from last yrs draft in DeFo (baalke), and then the best college DL in Solomon, and paired with best college LB Reuben. Suddenly our front 7 is starting to look professional, with top flite talent. AA(baalke) is back with a new shoulder. Lynch has put together a fine looking front 7. Dooms, DJ, Mitchell, Pita...all excellent picks or acquisitions.

RBs..just doubled our starting RB. And then added a piece we should have had all along, FB. We got the best out there in Jusczyk...but as a receiver and blocker.

WRs...already mentioned but best idea was getting rid of all the dead wood. We'll see how this plays out. I think next yr we spend more effort here.

TEs...got a couple with great potential, but right now that's all it is.

DBs...Spoon addition. Again, have to wait on these guys to see.

Overall, Sickness, we went from the worst talent in the league to an excellent front 7 , a great OL, great OW/FB, finally a developmental QB, we got rid of two lames from last two yrs at QB, and replaced them with a guy who has played for kyle and knows the WCO...great acquisiton. Plus a backup. That was their first move...right after firing our Trainer who had averaged 20 guys on IR the last 3 seasons.

Sickness, i could keep going, but i submit to you, that is one helluva FA and draft, plus other major moves (eg, trainer..had to be done). Also the big one:

Getting the yorks out of the managing of the team and giving controls over to football people. Now they may not be the people YOU wanted, but dang it, they are WAY WAY better Than the yorks. No more Singletary, Noln, erickson, chip, tomsul, baalke. That was all york pick stuff and it failed. Now we have professionals. The fact that you don't like them or the couple picks you named for WRs , doesn't diminish the quality of the improvements that have been made.

I personally felt we would not get out of the cellar until the team was sold. I was wrong. Lynch took over football ops (with plenty of backup....really good people) and we didn't ahve to wait fo the team to sell from the yorks to some Silicon Valley billionaire. This was way better. Oh, and now you see guys from the glory days hanging around campus. That is a small deal but means a lot to players, coaches, and fans.

So cheer up Sickness....everybody else is happy but you. Look at what's changed and we jsut went from awful to really talented in spots to very hopeful . Before LYnch and kyle arrived...we had no hope. And that is the God honest truth. Now we have hope and are able to rejoin the league. Last 17 yrs we have been a joke with a brief interlude of two yrs while harbaw was here, but he couldn't seal the deal. Lastly , our biggest concern, FR QB.

1. Kyle has great rapport with Cousins...and cousins has said he would like to play here. He signed no LT contract so this is still in the works ...a distinct possibility.
2. we have CJ, our first developmental Qb in so many yrs i can't remember the last one. And we will continue to acquire one per yr
3.we are greatly improved at qB just by virtue of our last two guys being gone. PlUS we got Kyle's guy, Hoyer , who can run the WCO while we look for the FR QB
3a. Got a backup also.
4. Got plenty of money for FR QB next yr,
5 .Got extra 2nd rd and 3rd rd picks for part of package to move up when our draft slot moves to mid pack, eg 16. We got money and picks to help us get a FR qb if kyle sees one who qualifies.

Now you tell me, Sickness, how much more did lynch have to do to make you happy? A couple different WRs? B.S. He and kyle have just done 2yrs of rebuild in 5 short months. That is what we should be focusing on.Not a couple of WRs we didn't get.

Are we done? Heck no. Still got the two big ones, FR QB and #1 WR to go. But at least when we do get them, and we will, they have a team, not a cesspool to come to. FR QB are much more likely to come here now with talent in lots of spots, esp OL and D. The psychology of that was well thot out. No FR QB now is going to look at SF as a "do not enter " zone. NOW, right now ,we look like a good team to want to come to. Six months ago...we definitely were not.

Yes, this is way long. But i am sick and tired of people grousing or complaining about the NEW, when the OLD is no further away than last yr . And if you or anyone else doesn't consider that, then i respectfully suggest you think it thru once again.

k.

Can we move this thread, no place for negativity.

ATT, i just tried to fix that...take an hour and read the above.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by NinerSickness:
Yes, he's playing it safe. New doesn't equal riskier. Paying huge money to a guy like Garcon is playing it safe because he's an amateur who doesn't know how to identify WR talent. He could have paid more money & gotten a better, younger WR long-term like Terrelle Pryor, but he went with a "meh" WR who's already 30 because he's playing for the short term. Higher floor; lower ceiling.

Kirk Cousins notwithstanding.

what a baloney comment.

There's a difference between playing it safe and being smart. We're one of the youngest teams in the league and can use a smart/good vet WR that just came off a 1,000 yard season....oh wait he knows the system too? BONUS

You can't just grab whomever you want in FA either, the player needs to want to come there as well. Garcon wanted to play for Kyle.

Pryor was such a coveted FA that he got what a one yr deal? you can't have a team full of JUST 20 something players.

Also what the f**k is wrong with being 30?? Seriously? Garcon's game is based around crisp route-running and playing smart tough football. IF he drops off a cliff they can move on from him after 2018 his contract is far from some back breaking HUGE contract.

What's wrong with being 30 is that he'll be long past effective by the time the Niners can compete for a SB. Lynch is playing for now because he's delusional & thinks Kirk friggn' Cousins is going to win a SB.

What he should've done is started to build for 2020, not for 2018. But he's gonna just plug whoever in at various positions, possibly make the playoffs & watch the Niners get their asses kicked by teams who had some vision.

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
ATT, i just tried to fix that...take an hour and read the above.

I doubt he will read that. Since he started posting..he is here just to troll.

Finger cramped midway scrolling threw Pasos comment but I'm sure it's good stuff that's already been said before.

Originally posted by NinerSickness:

What's wrong with being 30 is that he'll be long past effective by the time the Niners can compete for a SB. Lynch is playing for now because he's delusional & thinks Kirk friggn' Cousins is going to win a SB.

What he should've done is started to build for 2020, not for 2018. But he's gonna just plug whoever in at various positions, possibly make the playoffs & watch the Niners get their asses kicked by teams who had some vision.

Lol okay man...4 of the 5 top qbs this past yr are older than 30 and when the f**k is 30 old for a QB? How does a QB become s**t all of a sudden (dude is a pocket passing QB)? especially one tha has started for only two yrs, never missed a game, was sacked the 4th fewest in the league the past two seasons (because he gets rid of the ball), and judging from yr one to two is improving not declining. Is russel Wilson old? Cause he's only 3 months younger than him.

Bitter fan that didn't get his draft crush is all I'm hearing from you.

The NFL is the not for long league my man, top 10 qbs don't come onto the market ever. Bring Kirk and then draft a QB to learn behind him. I want lynch to improve this team as much as he can, tomorrow isn't a given in football and you have no idea about draft picks. I want proven players if given the chance to get one

Originally posted by NYniner85:
Lol okay man...4 of the 5 top qbs this past yr are older than 30 and when the f**k is 30 old for a QB?

I was talking about Garcon being 30, not Kirk. Obviously QBs can be effective longer than WRs can.

But enjoy your delusion about Kirk hoisting the Lombardi over his head (kind of like you enjoyed the delusion of Kaepernick being a good QB). It'll wear off soon enough, and your posts will be here to show you were wrong.