Coaches Film Analysis: 2017 Season

Originally posted by genus49:

Originally posted by cNiner:

Hopers decisions making is terrible, should have thrown the ball to 81 by the goal line .

There's no question in my mind Kuechly's earlier pick was the reason he didn't. Luke got in his head. He saw him flash in the area and didn't trust himself to get it there to beat Kuechly after the earlier pick.

Yeah, I thought Luke was all over that lane too, even in front of him.

Originally posted by thl408:
Mo' Bow

some sort of Counter play vs Over front. LG will pull to lead through the weakside C gap (off right tackle). Notice where the ball is spotted (OL feet).


Immediately after the snap, Bow steps towards the play. He's already diagnosed it.


Meets the pulling LG behind the line of scrimmage. So much for the LG leading through the hole. Bow met him in the hole.


RB has to move laterally because Bow stuffed the hole.

so what is the biggest difference between our run defense this year and last? why wasn't Bow able to stuff holes and contain like this last year? (not saying he didn't, or anyone else) the complete change in scheme? responsibilities now for his position?

Originally posted by Cisco0623:
Basically a lot of these plays where well designed and WR were open, but the o line (guards) suck ass so Hoyer was already running for his life? proof o-line is everything lol

Yep, I hope they get better, and I hope we get reinforcements next year.

Originally posted by Niners816:
So did anyone else shed a tear with the fact that formation variations have come back









This was just a sample from the first quarter....I'm not sure we ran 7 different formations all of last year.

yeah bringing me back to the harbaugh days

bring back this formation, and FRANK!



and yes, i know that's just a standard I formation. I'm referring to the winning part.

Originally posted by defenderDX:
so what is the biggest difference between our run defense this year and last? why wasn't Bow able to stuff holes and contain like this last year? (not saying he didn't, or anyone else) the complete change in scheme? responsibilities now for his position?

iirc, Bow did do stuff like this last year (despite the scheme) - but he got hurt.

Originally posted by defenderDX:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Tartt also had some lapses at FS when faced with trips. Robinson should sink vs Smash w/ Tartt moving to Dixon. Bowman is like like WTF? pic.twitter.com/2Sqfrrbwdw

— Oscar Aparicio (@BetterRivals) September 13, 2017

Tarrt isn't not a single high safety...that one handed INT was amazing but this stuff is ridiculous

you just said tartt is a single high safety.

Should be "is not a"

Thanks for pointing it out though buzzy

Originally posted by defenderDX:
so what is the biggest difference between our run defense this year and last? why wasn't Bow able to stuff holes and contain like this last year? (not saying he didn't, or anyone else) the complete change in scheme? responsibilities now for his position?

Besides the talent improvement from not having to play Skov, Bellore, and Purcell, there's also the simplified gap assignments in Saleh's defense. There was an article about Jim ONiel containing testimony from CLE players explaining that the run fits in that JoN CLE defense was incredibly complicated. It required the LBs to read what the DL was doing and react off of the DL. Basically they were exchanging gaps on the fly.

I can only guess what they were asked to do. My guess is if the OL blocked the DL into or out of a gap, the LB would have to read that and replace the gap that the DL got moved out of. In a perfect world, and on the whiteboard, maybe this is a great run defense scheme, but when an entire play lasts a total of 2-3 seconds, that is way too many mental decisions to make when a split second can mean the difference between meeting a lead blocker in the hole, or allowing that lead blocker to get 2 yards beyond the hole.

Here's a snippet from that article:
https://www.si.com/thecauldron/2015/10/21/mike-pettine-cleveland-browns-defense-problems-afc-north
Rather than being assigned specific gaps, Cleveland's defensive linemen play different techniques based on how their offensive counterparts are blocking them. The linebackers, then, are expected to guess what technique their teammates are using, scrape through the resulting mess and make the play.
"It's an entire guessing game," said one source. "Imagine trying to define mud."

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by BleedsRedNGold:
First year in a new system. We'll look sloppy. The best thing this team needs is continuity. Carolina was a team of familiar players playing in a familiar system. They would have got beaten handily by a better team. Our beatdown should have been worse.

...playing against a familiar offensive scheme.

It will take a while for the offense to gel, specially the WCO, it's notorious for starting slow. The second thing is that good linebackers always give the WCO grief. That's the weakness of the WCO, guys like Kuechly. That's why in this kind of a game, the WCO has to play the field position game and rely on defense to hold the fort so that you can have more shots. The going for the 4rth down thing when the defense was doing well, kinda was the worst thing you can do against a defense like this.

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by defenderDX:
so what is the biggest difference between our run defense this year and last? why wasn't Bow able to stuff holes and contain like this last year? (not saying he didn't, or anyone else) the complete change in scheme? responsibilities now for his position?

Besides the talent improvement from not having to play Skov, Bellore, and Purcell, there's also the simplified gap assignments in Saleh's defense. There was an article about Jim ONiel containing testimony from CLE players explaining that the run fits in that JoN CLE defense was incredibly complicated. It required the LBs to read what the DL was doing and react off of the DL. Basically they were exchanging gaps on the fly.

I can only guess what they were asked to do. My guess is if the OL blocked the DL into or out of a gap, the LB would have to read that and replace the gap that the DL got moved out of. In a perfect world, and on the whiteboard, maybe this is a great run defense scheme, but when an entire play lasts a total of 2-3 seconds, that is way too many mental decisions to make when a split second can mean the difference between meeting a lead blocker in the hole, or allowing that lead blocker to get 2 yards beyond the hole.

Here's a snippet from that article:
https://www.si.com/thecauldron/2015/10/21/mike-pettine-cleveland-browns-defense-problems-afc-north
Rather than being assigned specific gaps, Cleveland's defensive linemen play different techniques based on how their offensive counterparts are blocking them. The linebackers, then, are expected to guess what technique their teammates are using, scrape through the resulting mess and make the play.
"It's an entire guessing game," said one source. "Imagine trying to define mud."

I think overall, Saleh's scheme also fits better with what everybody else is doing. It's a pass happy league. I see it as basically blitzing 8 men to stop the run. The 8th man being Reid. Each guy takes a gap and directs the offense to spill the run to the Will/Safety position. The Fangio 3-4 basically played with 3 two gap D linemen and 4 linebackers, the Saleh/Leo defense basically removes one two gapper D Lineman, replaces him with a one gapper (Leo/Elephant) and you still have the other LEO, and replaces one LB with basically a strong safety. At least that's how I see it, when you see a guy like Reuben, Elijah or Armstrong - they aren't *that* much bigger than a strong safety - and they probably aren't *that* much slower than a Strong Safety either.

Originally posted by defenderDX:
so what is the biggest difference between our run defense this year and last? why wasn't Bow able to stuff holes and contain like this last year? (not saying he didn't, or anyone else) the complete change in scheme? responsibilities now for his position?

Cause he (Bow) only played in 3 and a half games last year?

This is what Kyle had to say about the outside zone run in this game:
"We did have an outside zone one that I thought we had everyone blocked and we just tripped going through the line. If we would have hit that one, it would have been a 30 yarder and then we would have really messed up your outside zone stats because the one we got would have been a gash, we just tripped. All the others weren't good ones. So, it looks like you're averaging .5 on the outside zones and it's just one play that changes it all for stats."

Pretty sure this is the play Kyle is referring to (near end of 2nd quarter):
1st & 10

^^^^Cohn is full of s**t trying to justify his narrative on that play. It looks like Carlos is tripped and if he wasn't that was at least a 20+ yard play.

Originally posted by Niners816:
^^^^Cohn is full of s**t trying to justify his narrative on that play. It looks like Carlos is tripped and if he wasn't that was at least a 20+ yard play.

Lol..Cohn is definitely full of it.

Also, Roger Craig wouldn't have been tripped there. Carlos. Dude. Get your knees up going through traffic like that.

Originally posted by Niners816:
^^^^Cohn is full of s**t trying to justify his narrative on that play. It looks like Carlos is tripped and if he wasn't that was at least a 20+ yard play.

"and then we would have really messed up your outside zone stats"

I got the sense Kyle was miffed about Cohn using stats to backup his point and not what actually happened.