LISTEN: The 49ers Get Snowplowed In Buffalo →

There are 291 users in the forums

Coaches Film Analysis: 2019 Season

Shop Find 49ers gear online
  • Furlow
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 22,051
Originally posted by Giedi:
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Dude let's just take a moment and realize how great juice/Kittle are as blockers it's Iike having two extra lineman out there


I think I watched that about 500 times today. I can't get enough of how awesome Kyle is on the run game. He's taken the run game to another level.

New West Coast run offense? It's pretty much unstoppable with the right kind of players.

Green Bay were in 8 man fronts a majority of those run plays and Kyle was still gashing them for 10+ yards a pop. dang!

Green Bay defenders looked so lost and defeated lol.
  • thl408
  • Moderator
  • Posts: 33,072
Originally posted by Furlow:
Originally posted by thl408:
My theory on why this is being done is that some offenses will to dial up certain route combinations to the boundary side, and certain route combinations to the field side. So having one CB always play the boundary, and one CB always play the field, allows that CB to repeatedly see the same route combinations run against him.

This and skillset. I played field-side CB in college and that was because I was a better cover corner than I was a tackler. Our boundary CB was bigger, not as fast, but more physical. That describes Moseley and Sherman as well. I wasn't even aware the 49ers do this, thanks for pointing that out.

Good insight about skillet. Sherman isn't as fast as Moseley so that's why Sherman was boundary, less space to cover. The 49ers only did it for a drive and a half vs GB. After that, Sherman was back at his LCB spot for the rest of the game. But it was in 2017 that they did it for the entire game, then stopped after week 5.
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Originally posted by Paul_Hofer:
Originally posted by Bluesbro:
Originally posted by thl408:
Originally posted by Paul_Hofer:
When Walsh installed a 4-1-6 in SB 19 (including on first down), the Niners had previously played a 3-4 in base. He took out regulars Dan Bunz, Riki Ellison and Jack Reynolds at linebacker. He replaced them with ER Fred Dean and DBs Tom Holmoe and Dana McLemore. Holmoe and McLemore had been little used in defense previously. So, the Niners' defense underwent at least as big of a change as I'm suggesting might be considered in SB 54.
Good knowledge. I was too young to remember those specifics. Seems like it can happen and it'd be a wrinkle KC can't scout for since it's not on film. If Saleh uses it, it'd be such a Belichik-like adjustment. I'm not going to pretend I know more than Saleh. If he goes with this tactic, he'll have his good reasons.
I doubt he makes any big changes, at least to start. For all his talk about 'all gas no brakes', it seems like his natural tendencies are to play it safe.
You may be right, but Saleh did early on "travel" Sherman to follow Davante Adams in the NFC title game. That was a big change. After the Niners big lead, Saleh played it safer by reverting to form with Sherman staying on the left side. But Adams was more successful in the second half.
Saleh said he was just trying to mess with Matt LeFleur's head. By showing that early, you make it less predictable who will be where and who's on who. For example, if you're in 2nd and 9, teams might run to the right side, not to get a first down, but to create more room to the left side of the field away from Sherman to work a concept. If you've shown Sherm on the left side once or twice, they're going to think twice about using such an approach and now you've got them playing out of their gameplan.

Regardless of the reason for the change, my comment responded to Bluesbro's suggestion that Saleh wouldn't make any big changes like installing a 4-1-6. Moving Sherman was a big change even if for only a handful of plays. While Saleh mentioned "boundary" in his explanation why Sherman played the right side, he also mentions the reason as expecting the Packers to attack with a "go-ball" early.

Reporter's question:
Richard moved to the right side a couple times last game. He was saying maybe just kind of to mess with them. I'm not going to ask whether you're going to do it in the Super Bowl, but was that the thinking, was to mess around with them? And has he moved very much in the last few years here?
Saleh answered:
"He hasn't. It was just to throw a wrench, whatever wrench that we could create early in the game. We were trying to find ways that they could attack us and we thought maybe they would come out and just try to throw a go-ball early. So, just put him out there to the boundary and really get [Green Bay Packers head coach Matt] Matty [LaFleur] thinking a little bit. So, that was about it."
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Dude let's just take a moment and realize how great juice/Kittle are as blockers it's Iike having two extra lineman out there





Anyone else still thinks we overpaid this Juice guy?
  • thl408
  • Moderator
  • Posts: 33,072
Thanks for posting that quote from Saleh. As I stated above, this isn't the first time Saleh has played his CBs like this. If Saleh was scared of an early "go ball", I guess the 49ers scouted that GB likes to throw the Go route to the boundary. The long reception that DAdams had over Sherman in the 2nd half was to the boundary.
Originally posted by 808niner4lyphe:


Anyone else still thinks we overpaid this Juice guy?

The Juice is worth the squeeze
  • Furlow
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 22,051
Originally posted by thl408:
Originally posted by Furlow:
Originally posted by thl408:
My theory on why this is being done is that some offenses will to dial up certain route combinations to the boundary side, and certain route combinations to the field side. So having one CB always play the boundary, and one CB always play the field, allows that CB to repeatedly see the same route combinations run against him.

This and skillset. I played field-side CB in college and that was because I was a better cover corner than I was a tackler. Our boundary CB was bigger, not as fast, but more physical. That describes Moseley and Sherman as well. I wasn't even aware the 49ers do this, thanks for pointing that out.

Good insight about skillet. Sherman isn't as fast as Moseley so that's why Sherman was boundary, less space to cover. The 49ers only did it for a drive and a half vs GB. After that, Sherman was back at his LCB spot for the rest of the game. But it was in 2017 that they did it for the entire game, then stopped after week 5.

Yeah I thought Sherman just played the left side exclusively, so now I don't feel as dumb. Lol. Perhaps they just saw something that they wanted to try to expose, or mix it up to throw Rodgers off.
  • Giedi
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 33,368
Originally posted by Furlow:
Originally posted by Giedi:
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Dude let's just take a moment and realize how great juice/Kittle are as blockers it's Iike having two extra lineman out there


I think I watched that about 500 times today. I can't get enough of how awesome Kyle is on the run game. He's taken the run game to another level.

New West Coast run offense? It's pretty much unstoppable with the right kind of players.

Green Bay were in 8 man fronts a majority of those run plays and Kyle was still gashing them for 10+ yards a pop. dang!

Green Bay defenders looked so lost and defeated lol.


Loved how the game was pretty much comfortably over by halftime.
Originally posted by Bluesbro:

This looks to me like this type of dominant run game takes more time to coordinate than the passing game. Seems like 2 years in the making.
  • Giedi
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 33,368
Originally posted by 808niner4lyphe:
Originally posted by NYniner85:
Dude let's just take a moment and realize how great juice/Kittle are as blockers it's Iike having two extra lineman out there





Anyone else still thinks we overpaid this Juice guy?

Juszczyk is another Tight End, as far as I'm concerned. I think his true skill set (in addition to blocking) is those wonderful hands that he has in catching passes. I believe good pass catchers (be it running backs or tight ends) are paid more than just blocking TE's or fullbacks. If so, Juszczyk deserves every cent Kyle is giving him.
Originally posted by qnnhan7:
Originally posted by Bluesbro:

This looks to me like this type of dominant run game takes more time to coordinate than the passing game. Seems like 2 years in the making.

This guy keeps coming along and setting too high of a standard for ametuer stuff.....LOL
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Originally posted by thl408:
Originally posted by ProfessorKel:
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Originally posted by SkyZer0:
Originally posted by GEEK:
Originally posted by SkyZer0:
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Originally posted by Paul_Hofer:
Jonny,
Could Saleh employ a 4-2-5 or 4-1-6 against the Chiefs?
and/or
Tavarious Moore as a spy on Mahomes and/on man coverage on T. Hill?

We did throw T. Moore in, in a "big" Dime for a couple plays against GB. I could see us utilizing that a lot in the SB, for real. T. Moore can match anyone, even T. Hill, in speed and also has put on size to be an interchangeable safety. The personnel one those plays were: Bosa, Buck, AA, Ford, Warner, Moore, K'Waun, Tartt, Ward, Moseley and Sherm.

With how piss poor KC is at running it and how our D-line matches their O-line I can see us stopping the run and getting pressure with our front 4 and letting the speed roam and frustrate their passing offense.

moore is that fast? wut

Moore has 4.3 speed, yo.

WAT

Yeah, he ran like a 4.33 or something at the combine and he's about as tall as sherm

During E-Man's interception and the defense rushed down to the endzone and did the whole "group photo" pose, Moore was in.

I was wondering why I saw #33, but now that you're mentioning he was in on dime-packages, that makes sense! Let's go!!!!! The Chiefs are not ready for our detail, chemistry, and relentlessness.

They whole defense went to celebrate on that EMann INT (Spoon got in the picture too, he was not on the field for the INT). Moore had a total of 1 defensive snap in the GB game (according to pro football reference), and that wasn't the play.

Maybe Saleh has a few packages where Moore is in, but I'm hesitant to put an inexperienced guy in any type of semi-significant role, on the biggest stage, vs a high skill receiving corp. If he is in the SB, my guess is Ward comes down to play CB and Moore is in at safety. No way should Saleh put a guy that was a college safety, one year as CB, then back to safety, back to CB for the Super Bowl.

I'm not a fan of him coming in a completely different position or role, but since he's played one of our safeties and our safeties are pretty interchangeable, we play with safeties in deep 1/3, hook/curl and curl/flat zones a lot in our D. I could see them subbing him in for a big DIME in one of those zones. He's got game experience and with our matching zone I like him in a hook/curl matching T. Hill on those deep over routes a lot more than K'Waun Williams or Greenlaw. Wouldn't be anything new for him, really.

I hope in dime they put Moore at Free Safety and put Ward on Kelce.
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Originally posted by qnnhan7:
Originally posted by Bluesbro:

This looks to me like this type of dominant run game takes more time to coordinate than the passing game. Seems like 2 years in the making.

This guy keeps coming along and setting too high of a standard for ametuer stuff.....LOL

Between you and Alex Rollins, you have the market locked on 49er breakdowns. I appreciate both your work.

It makes ESPN and the NFL Network unwatchable.
I keep watching the short trap play and keep thinking tomlinson is gonna have trouble keeping Chris Jones from blowing up the play
Share 49ersWebzone