SAN FRANCISCO 49ERS at SEATTLE SEAHAWKS - 2019 Game 16

Originally posted by Aj_hwd954:

Originally posted by RabidNiner:

How the hell is this thread still alive, after becoming a Montana/Young whiner fest?

Thank Mayo for saying he hates a legend and calling him a villain

I thought so. It's all Mayo's fault then.

Man, I'm reliving dead and buried memories as I read this thread.

Originally posted by Aj_hwd954:

Originally posted by Ottawa49er:

Originally posted by cciowa:

I like young very much but at the time and still am... of the opinion.. we should have kept montana. groomed bono. traded young who lost two nfc title games in a row. that was when the fan base, unlike now. did not tolerate losing those sorts of games . you trade him to the chiefs for derrick thomas. you then should have kept lott which meant you could keep haley. the defense would be fixed. we would never have had to go to salary cap hell in order to buy steve young a defense. and by keeping montana. the team would have been forced to address the running back spot which they never did after ricky left which cost us bad

Agree....Young was a great QB, but Montana was better still.

Personally I dont really blame Young for those nfc championship losses, or any other playoff loss they took during his run. Even though the team did a lot of winning in the 90s, they also made some dicey roster decisions, but trading Montana wasn't one of them, although I can understand why people would make a case for it. the ones that hurt the most was trading Charles Haley and letting Ricky Watters walk, especially Haley. Could you imagine the early 90s 49ers roster if they would've just dealt with his antics???? He would've been a trump card, if the card literally flipped the table over, and shot the other player! Those 90s Cowboys would've been nothing more than a stepping stone for those teams

That's my memory too. It was the Haley trade by a rookie head coach that sealed the deal for Steve to be second fiddle to Aikman in the 90's.

Originally posted by Dsoto87:

Just to clarify, the guys not crapping on young completely. In fact he's saying he was a great regular season QB, just that he didn't always perform up to that level in the post season. I can't confirm that one way or another, I just think y'all should actually argue his point and not make general statements like that.

He's absolutely crapping on Young's career. Saying a QB is a great regular season performer, but a bad playoff performer is a put down. The worst part is Young crushed the entire league in 1994. Won MVP and SB MVP, and some fans are dismissing it and criticizing why he didn't do that more often. Its completely ridiculous.

Originally posted by Giedi:

That's my memory too. It was the Haley trade by a rookie head coach that sealed the deal for Steve to be second fiddle to Aikman in the 90's.

A rookie head coach?

Originally posted by Niners99:

Originally posted by Dsoto87:

Just to clarify, the guys not crapping on young completely. In fact he's saying he was a great regular season QB, just that he didn't always perform up to that level in the post season. I can't confirm that one way or another, I just think y'all should actually argue his point and not make general statements like that.

He's absolutely crapping on Young's career. Saying a QB is a great regular season performer, but a bad playoff performer is a put down. The worst part is Young crushed the entire league in 1994. Won MVP and SB MVP, and some fans are dismissing it and criticizing why he didn't do that more often. Its completely ridiculous.

I never said he was a "bad" playoff performer. I'm saying he wasn't a great playoff performer. And that if he was just able to be great.....like he demonstrated all his greatness in the regular season....he would have one one or two additional SBs.

You think he was great in the postseason outside of 1994? No, he was not. He may have been good but he made some mistakes we usually didnt see from him because he was SO GREAT during the regular seasons every year.

Not going to apologize for including his ok playoff performances in my overall judgment of him. He was a top 15 QB of all time. That is from his regular season greatness capped off by one year in 1994 when he produced the goods and was great in the playoffs against Dallas and even more so in the SB.

Steve Young was a great QB. One who also partially responsible for some of our losses against Dallas/GB as he did not play up to his level of demonstrated GREATNESS during the regular season. Because he demonstrated this GREATNESS I hoped/expected he would demonstrate the same GREATNESS in the postseason. Outside of 1994, he did not. That does not mean he did not have a great career; of course he did. He was and is a Super Bowl champion. I thought he was so great during the season that I he would play just as great in the postseason...MORE OFTEN. Obv he balled in 1994 and got us that SB. Niner legend. That does not mean he is untouchable and above any criticism for his playoff performances during his career against Dallas and GB.

Are you actually arguing that he was great in the postseason outside of 1994? How old are you? You may he older than me or maybe not...I am 40.

Can we please move on? This is absolutely ridiculous

Originally posted by Aj_hwd954:

Can we please move on? This is absolutely ridiculous

+1

Originally posted by John_Candy:
Another thing about 92, Young had a TD pass called back because of a BS holding call early in the game. We would later take a 7-3 lead. So how much would the game have changed if we jumped out to a 14-3 lead?

And we fumbled a punt early. Watters also lost a fumble in that game. Cofer missed a FG.

^

Originally posted by VaBeachNiner:

Originally posted by John_Candy:

Another thing about 92, Young had a TD pass called back because of a BS holding call early in the game. We would later take a 7-3 lead. So how much would the game have changed if we jumped out to a 14-3 lead?

And we fumbled a punt early. Watters also lost a fumble in that game. Cofer missed a FG.

^

Just watched the 1992 game over again...

Young played well overall. He threw a bad pick in the 4th quarter in the middle of the field with a 24-13 score BUT it didnt lead to points as Dallas turned it over at the 5 yard line. His last pick with less than 2 minutes to go and down 30-20 and had to force it to try and make a play.

Upon rewatching again, fumble by Watters was a big error and INT a big error. Only the former cost us as Dallas went in and scored off the fumble. Dallas was able to drain some clock after the INT which hurt.

Either way this wasn't on Young. He didn't play great but didn't play average either. He was good most of the game and I dont put the last INT on him under two minutes and forced to go downfield. Would have needed onside kick even if we score that drive.

Next up...1993 game. I'll do this for 1993, 95, 96, 97, 98.

But I must freely admit my view of Young in the 1992 game is a little different after a fresh watch. Young had that great TD pass called back for holding...seemed like a legit hold. Dallas had long drives and owned TOP as well. If Dallas ices the game after his first INT to go up 31-13 though then that is very costly. But they didnt and we turned them over on their next drive. No harm no foul other than a few precious minutes of game clock lost which did have an impact as we ran out of time.

Not holding this one against Young anymore. He played well and his main INT was bad but didnt cost us...thus it is thrown out.

1993 up next...let's see how that one goes. We got trounced but Dallas defending champs at home.

Originally posted by aQBnamedtouchback:

Originally posted by Niners99:

Originally posted by mayo49:
It was Camelot and Young stuck his nose all in it. Joe still had a couple of good years left - Young could have waited his turn, but forced the teams hand.

Ridiculous line of thought. Young was the NFL MVP in 1992. Keeping him on the bench because of Montana nostalgia would've been irresponsible. Also, Young was 31, and had been the backup for 5 years. How long did you want him to wait? In 1992-93-94, all years Montana was still playing, Young won the MVP twice, was first team All-Pro all 3 years, and won SB MVP. You wanted to keep him benched for Montana in his last years?

Yes Steve was Hall of Fame. The real f**k up the Front Office did was trade Haley to the freaking Cowboys of all teams. If we had Haleyz we probably are saying Young was just as good as Joe.

There were a lot of blunders in the 90s. Trading Haley to the Cowboys ( a young team that had just made the playoffs ) was the biggest blunder. Letting Ricky Watters walk was number two. And horrible drafting in the 90s. So as the Niners aged, the talent wasn't replenished and we had to spend more and more in fee agency as the decade went on. Keeping Haley and Watters gives Young a Super Bowl in 92 and 95 minimum.

omg

Originally posted by LifelongNiner:

Originally posted by aQBnamedtouchback:

Originally posted by Niners99:

Originally posted by mayo49:
It was Camelot and Young stuck his nose all in it. Joe still had a couple of good years left - Young could have waited his turn, but forced the teams hand.

+ Show all quotes
Ridiculous line of thought. Young was the NFL MVP in 1992. Keeping him on the bench because of Montana nostalgia would've been irresponsible. Also, Young was 31, and had been the backup for 5 years. How long did you want him to wait? In 1992-93-94, all years Montana was still playing, Young won the MVP twice, was first team All-Pro all 3 years, and won SB MVP. You wanted to keep him benched for Montana in his last years?

Yes Steve was Hall of Fame. The real f**k up the Front Office did was trade Haley to the freaking Cowboys of all teams. If we had Haleyz we probably are saying Young was just as good as Joe.

There were a lot of blunders in the 90s. Trading Haley to the Cowboys ( a young team that had just made the playoffs ) was the biggest blunder. Letting Ricky Watter walk was number two. And horrible drafting in the 90s. So as the Niners aged, the talent wasn't replenished and we had to spend more and more in fee agency as the decade went on. Keeping Haley and Watters gives Young a Super Bowl in 92 and 95 minimum.

Neon Deion was a monster, the best corner I have ever seen. When we had him in '94, it was really really really good. When he left to go to the Cowboys in '95, it was really really really bad.

How bout we get back to the topic.

https://youtu.be/DndWGSH2wAs

Originally posted by 49ers808:

How bout we get back to the topic.

https://youtu.be/DndWGSH2wAs

This is a free thread now. The mods told us to take the argument here.

Originally posted by 49ers808:
How bout we get back to the topic.

.be

Nice win