George Seifert > Bill Cowher / Jimmy Johnson???

Originally posted by tjd808185:

You can only blame us. We fired Seifert because he didn't win enough for us. So if we didn't see him as a great coach at the time why would HoF voters?

Thats a good point too.

Originally posted by TheGore49er:

Originally posted by tjd808185:
You can only blame us. We fired Seifert because he didn't win enough for us. So if we didn't see him as a great coach at the time why would HoF voters?

Thats a good point too.

it was also SAD to hear him (HBO's Inside the NFL) say that it was a WIN WIN situation even if they lose to Dallas (2nd NFCCG) because it's either the Super Bowl or the Pro Bowl !!!

DAMNNNNNN !!!!

.. and the fact that he couldn't do CRAP with the Panthers, it just proved that he inherited a great 49er team when he won.. while the 2nd Super Bowl win was almost a "purchase" ..

George is another example of a great coordinator that wasn't really that good as a HC. Two very different jobs.

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:
George is another example of a great coordinator that wasn't really that good as a HC. Two very different jobs.

disagree., very good coach. sure he handled the haley thing wrong. but bill handled the joe vs steve horribly

Originally posted by CardinalGold:

Seifert inherited a SB winning team from Walsh. He won 2 SBs off that talent but made poor draft, personnel, and coaching decisions which led to the slow demise of the dynasty (if FA were as active then as it is now, it would have been a faster demise).

Johnson took a 1-15 franchise and drafted and coached it to 2 SBs himself and set it up for a third under Switzer. If Jerry didn't have such a big ego and fire Johnson, the Cowboys might have been a Patriots like dynasty.

So yeah, JJ deserves the HoF over Seifert. And I say that as a Cowboy hating Niner fan since 1982.

This!!!
But, i still love Seifert since he grew up a Niner and ran a great defense in the 80s. Holmgren should have been the HC after Walsh but Walsh hand picked Seifert over Holmgren. Seifert's true colors and coaching skills showed up when he took over the Panthers.

Originally posted by cciowa:
disagree., very good coach. sure he handled the haley thing wrong. but bill handled the joe vs steve horribly

He was okay, but he had a lot of his success because of the team that Walsh built. He won a SB the year after Walsh and didn't get back for 5 years after Policy and Eddie went out and bought every former pro bowl free agent that was available. He had very limited success at Carolina.

Originally posted by tjd808185:

You can only blame us. We fired Seifert because he didn't win enough for us. So if we didn't see him as a great coach at the time why would HoF voters?

So fired coaches shouldn't be in the Hall of Fame? So Andy Reid and Tony Dungy should've never gone. Does it count for players that were cut? I don't buy this one. Its the Carolina stint. We know the perception of Seifert. It's unfair in my opinion because no one has ever kept a great team/dynasty going like Seifert. No one. I can live if he never got in, but once they let Cowher in .

Originally posted by 9moon:

SEIFERT - never got the credit because Bill Walsh had built a POWER HOUSE team... it was also sad to see how Seifert was the 1st coach to not be LIFTED after winning the Super Bowl.

He was also remembered for not able to beat the Packers and Jimmy Johnson in the Playoffs.. People really looked at Seifert the way they looked at Barry Switzer or even Jon Gruden.. Coaches who just INHERITED a team ready to be GREAT..

But everyone knows those teams went down the further they got from their predecessor. Aikman even thinks the 94 Cowboys are better than the 95 Cowboys.

With Seifert, the '89 Niners were BETTER than the 88 Niners. Makes me sick to see him compared to those other guys.

Originally posted by LifelongNiner:

Originally posted by tjd808185:
You can only blame us. We fired Seifert because he didn't win enough for us. So if we didn't see him as a great coach at the time why would HoF voters?

So fired coaches shouldn't be in the Hall of Fame? So Andy Reid and Tony Dungy should've never gone. Does it count for players that were cut? I don't buy this one. Its the Carolina stint. We know the perception of Seifert. It's unfair in my opinion because no one has ever kept a great team/dynasty going like Seifert. No one. I can live if he never got in, but once they let Cowher in .

Originally posted by 9moon:
SEIFERT - never got the credit because Bill Walsh had built a POWER HOUSE team... it was also sad to see how Seifert was the 1st coach to not be LIFTED after winning the Super Bowl.

He was also remembered for not able to beat the Packers and Jimmy Johnson in the Playoffs.. People really looked at Seifert the way they looked at Barry Switzer or even Jon Gruden.. Coaches who just INHERITED a team ready to be GREAT..

But everyone knows those teams went down the further they got from their predecessor. Aikman even thinks the 94 Cowboys are better than the 95 Cowboys.

With Seifert, the '89 Niners were BETTER than the 88 Niners. Makes me sick to see him compared to those other guys.

VERY TRUE.. but the fact is, even had Walsh stayed, we would have gone BACK TO BACK that year... We simply just started to hit all cylinder after the Cincy Super Bowl.. we were too good...

in the end, Seifert' accomplishment could not be compared to both Cowher and Jimmy.

Originally posted by 9moon:

Originally posted by LifelongNiner:

Originally posted by tjd808185:

You can only blame us. We fired Seifert because he didn't win enough for us. So if we didn't see him as a great coach at the time why would HoF voters?

So fired coaches shouldn't be in the Hall of Fame? So Andy Reid and Tony Dungy should've never gone. Does it count for players that were cut? I don't buy this one. Its the Carolina stint. We know the perception of Seifert. It's unfair in my opinion because no one has ever kept a great team/dynasty going like Seifert. No one. I can live if he never got in, but once they let Cowher in .

Originally posted by 9moon:

SEIFERT - never got the credit because Bill Walsh had built a POWER HOUSE team... it was also sad to see how Seifert was the 1st coach to not be LIFTED after winning the Super Bowl.

He was also remembered for not able to beat the Packers and Jimmy Johnson in the Playoffs.. People really looked at Seifert the way they looked at Barry Switzer or even Jon Gruden.. Coaches who just INHERITED a team ready to be GREAT..

But everyone knows those teams went down the further they got from their predecessor. Aikman even thinks the 94 Cowboys are better than the 95 Cowboys.

With Seifert, the '89 Niners were BETTER than the 88 Niners. Makes me sick to see him compared to those other guys.

VERY TRUE.. but the fact is, even had Walsh stayed, we would have gone BACK TO BACK that year... We simply just started to hit all cylinder after the Cincy Super Bowl.. we were too good...

in the end, Seifert' accomplishment could not be compared to both Cowher and Jimmy.

Jimmy deserves it. Cowher, I'm sorry. If Seifert's accomplishments weren't so great, then why didn't other people do the same? See the Packers after Holngren. See the Cowboys after Jimmy. Washington after Gibbs. Giants after Parcells. Packers after Lombardi. Bucs after Dungy. Winning 10+ every year is no guarantee, no matter how good the team is. Not saying he's a HOF shoo in. But we minimize his accomplishments too much.

It's not if Walsh had stayed. It's the fact that Seifert kept it going. 2 Super Bowls and 5 NFCCGs in 8 years. Who else did that?

Seifert and Rodger Craig are being screwed. The NFL is the WWE with a football. Goddell should really walk onto the field and do the Vince McMahon.

Originally posted by LifelongNiner:

So fired coaches shouldn't be in the Hall of Fame? So Andy Reid and Tony Dungy should've never gone. Does it count for players that were cut? I don't buy this one. Its the Carolina stint. We know the perception of Seifert. It's unfair in my opinion because no one has ever kept a great team/dynasty going like Seifert. No one. I can live if he never got in, but once they let Cowher in .


But everyone knows those teams went down the further they got from their predecessor. Aikman even thinks the 94 Cowboys are better than the 95 Cowboys.

With Seifert, the '89 Niners were BETTER than the 88 Niners. Makes me sick to see him compared to those other guys.

Actually my point is a bit off for a different reason. He quit here, he wasn't fired. I certainly wasn't saying Bill can't make the HoF because he was canned by Clv. It's when your SB team doesn't respect your accomplishments that you got a problem and that was the case with Seifert.

Originally posted by NinerGM:
Why do people keep saying "inherited" a grey team? Seifert was part of the organization for years that helped build the 49ers into what they were at their greatest point. Yes Walsh was a genius, but he was genius to know you can't do everything by yourself. The demise of the 49ers came slowly through the front office/personnel decisions. McVay leaving. Scouting not being as strong. Really average to poor drafting. Complacency is inevitable when there's hyper success. Even Eddie lost the team due to his own hubris.

George doesn't get enough credit. And post 94 SB losses were again due to a front office that didn't recognize key players, let them walk and the team lost (Ricky Watters).

which tells you all along that Seifert never had a voice... infact, the only voice he had was the drafting of Keith DeLong and Israel Ifianyi (did i spell that right) ??

Jimmy - yes

Cowher - no IF Seifert is a NO

Holmgren - no

Shanahan - no

The fact that Jimmy Johnson wasnt a HOF is laughable. He's one of the more iconic coaches in history. SMH. With that said, Seitfort and Flores should be HOF material. Cowher doesnt belong in there IMO.

Originally posted by jcs:
Tomlin has two SB wins so yes.

He has one SB win. He won one, lost one against GB.

Originally posted by NinerGM:
Why do people keep saying "inherited" a grey team? Seifert was part of the organization for years that helped build the 49ers into what they were at their greatest point. Yes Walsh was a genius, but he was genius to know you can't do everything by yourself. The demise of the 49ers came slowly through the front office/personnel decisions. McVay leaving. Scouting not being as strong. Really average to poor drafting. Complacency is inevitable when there's hyper success. Even Eddie lost the team due to his own hubris.

George doesn't get enough credit. And post 94 SB losses were again due to a front office that didn't recognize key players, let them walk and the team lost (Ricky Watters).

This. People act like Seifert walked in off the street and was handed the keys to the team. He was a crucial part of a coaching staff that won 3 SBs before he ever became HC. Ultimately what killed the 49ers dynasty was poor drafting and free agency decisions. Missing on way too many draft picks and blowing money on way too many free agent busts. If you ask the average 49ers fan to name one draft pick from between 1995 to 1999, most will only be able to come up with TO. Maybe some will say Stokes who was still a disappointment considering that the 49ers moved up from Ray Lewis to draft him. There was just a lot of mismanagement, like letting Ricky Watters walk after the SB and not replacing him with any RB that was worth a damn.