Are the Niners better of worse than their Super Bowl team after the draft?

Originally posted by TheRickestRick:

Originally posted by KID9R:

Originally posted by TheRickestRick:

Originally posted by KID9R:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

I wouldn't say they're better. I mean it's pretty freaking hard to be better following a super bowl.

That said they got younger and cheaper. They have young guys who will improve.

SF was one of the most injured teams last yr as well.

No we weren't. That was the healthiest I've ever remembered our team being throughout the season.

Thats like saying they were the youngest person in a nursing home. They were healthier than the previous two years but that isnt saying much when the team has been in the top 3 IR users for the past few years. Not as many guys went to the IR like last year but it's not like we experienced much good luck in the health department.

lol We were actually one of the healthiest teams in the league last year.
https://bookies.com/news/true-gambling-impact-of-injuries-heading-into-2020-nfl-playoffs

Context... We got healthy at the right time and most of the injuries werent IR landing... getting healthy at the right time was the gist of every article leading up to the playoffs lol. That article mentions GB as having some of the most injuries but when we played them... their health and not having a single person on the injury report was one of the topics the entire week leading up to the game. I'd be more interested in comparing games missed by starters, that article definitely isnt taking that as a metric.

In terms of starters, lost both tackles, RBs,WR, FB, LB, TE, C and Safeties for multiple games. Blair and DJ, our LBs... the team was battling the injury bug pretty hard but luckily most werent season ending and healed right before the playoffs. It's hard to remember playing a team we were healthier than outside of the Steelers. Every team has injuries but there werent many we played that had as many starters missing as we did before the playoffs.

Lol!!!!! We had a crap ton of injuries. Are you high??? Both Ts, both S. Our big pass rush acquisition played about 20% of the snaps and our big FA MLB missed most of the year. Kittle, Sherm, Spoon, Williams and Juice and DJ Jones. Sanders had the rib problem. We lost Richburg for the year. Healthiest team in the league??? Wtf are you talking about??? It's a wonder they were so dominant.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Definitely not better but cheaper with more long term security. And the 'chance' to be better if all the rookies play up to their expectations.

The next level in this excellent topic and post is to compare our roster to our top competitors as our ultimate goal, is to WIN the Superbowl this time around.

Dallas
Green Bay
Minnesota
Chicago
New Orleans
Tampa Bay
Atlanta
Seattle
Arizona

What does give us a chance to be better is continuity and a return of 16 players (some key) from injuries...not our acquisitions.

But what about existing young players taking the next step. Greenlaw, Deebo, dj Jones,Brunskill, Mosely, Moore etc. plus Jimmy G with a full year of experience under his belt. Continuity is critical. Massive amount of players coming off IR? Doesn't any of that count

Originally posted by bzborow1:

Originally posted by philgardis49:

Originally posted by NinerBuff:

Originally posted by ninerfan4life:

We are the team to beat in the NFC

Hmm I still think we're the second best team in the NFC after the Saints. I understand we beat them at their place, but that game could easily have gone the other way. But I think it's pulling hairs.

Saints and Niners are 1a / 1b
Bucs are a big ?
Seahawks are always tough
GB, DAL, PHI, MIN are a step behind
and ARI is arrow up.

Saints are not better than us and we proved that last year. Their window is all about shut, and ours just opened. As for the Bucs until we see what Brady can do with Evans and Godwin we won't know how good the Bucs are but it does help a little that he does have his security blanket in Gronk with him but he Is a question mark too after sitting for a year.
I will admit Seattle always gives us fits but I know we can beat them, GB has a QB controversy and no weapons, DAL, PHI,and MIN are second tier and ARI as you said is building.
I honestly think in the NFC at least we are the team to beat and I think we have a damn good shot this year with Jimmy having another year under Shannahan to go all the way.

I think MIN got a lot better with their draft.

They better. The had 356 picks.

Originally posted by KID9R:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

I wouldn't say they're better. I mean it's pretty freaking hard to be better following a super bowl.

That said they got younger and cheaper. They have young guys who will improve.

SF was one of the most injured teams last yr as well.

No we weren't. That was the healthiest I've ever remembered our team being throughout the season.

Ummmmmmm. No.

https://www.49erswebzone.com/forum/niners/189063-injuries-6-year-analysis/

I don't think it's fair to say we are now BETTER... and that included " ON PAPER "... what have this team done ??

I'd say we're about the same with a slight lean to being better.

Our oline should be better since TW is younger and just as good if not better than (a 2019) Staley. That rookie we got is versatile af, he could definitely help out at guard. The 2nd year guys, Garland and everyone else got valuable experience from going deep into the playoffs / SB. IMO, we'll be better than last year in that dept.

We gotta see what happens with our first two picks. They haven't played one down yet. At least we know they were studs in college. Plus we got younger, especially with the replacement of Sanders.

JJ might be slower than Sherman's slow ass, but he's young, physical and we finally got a big WR who is only going to get stronger and more polished. He is thrilled to be a Niner and seems to have very good work ethics. He'll definitely push Hurd and vice versa.

The TE is viewed as tough and an exceptional blocker who also played FB, he could help out big time in ST as well.

I'm trying to be optimistic by believing the secondary (I'm not thrilled about) will also improve. Other than that, what's not to like?

I think we repeat last year's ride with a much better ending...

Buckner was the better talent, Kinlaw fits better the 3T or 5T on this system.
Losing Sanders hurts he was the veteran presence. Aiyuk is better prospect than Sanders when coming out of college, but he is still a rookie, no OTA and TC is still in question.
Trent Williams is better than Staley and younger.
Brunskill is an upgrade over Mike Person.
The rookie TE should be an slight improvement over Toilolo.
Almost all the moves were lateral jumps.
We could expect some of they young guys taking an step forward. Is Solomon Thomas going to do something on his contract year? Will Witherspoon get his s**t together? Will Pettis feel the pressure from all the competition around him? Will Moseley develop? And, most important of them all, is Jimmy G taking an step forward as a franchise QB?
Health will be a big factor as well. Will Mckinnon be finally healthy? Hurd and Taylor will stay healthy? Will Verrett will be healthy for once in his career? How are DJ Jones, Blair and Taylor coming back from their injuries? Is Weston Richburg going to stay healthy for once?
This was a restocking offseason, replace talent with talent (something Baalke could never do). Next offseason they have to decide if Jimmy G is the answer, they have to rebuild the secondary and the IOL.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by KID9R:

Originally posted by NYniner85:

I wouldn't say they're better. I mean it's pretty freaking hard to be better following a super bowl.

That said they got younger and cheaper. They have young guys who will improve.

SF was one of the most injured teams last yr as well.

No we weren't. That was the healthiest I've ever remembered our team being throughout the season.

Ummmmmmm. No.

https://www.49erswebzone.com/forum/niners/189063-injuries-6-year-analysis/

If all the knees are good Niners are a better team

Originally posted by Cutitoff:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Definitely not better but cheaper with more long term security. And the 'chance' to be better if all the rookies play up to their expectations.

The next level in this excellent topic and post is to compare our roster to our top competitors as our ultimate goal, is to WIN the Superbowl this time around.

Dallas
Green Bay
Minnesota
Chicago
New Orleans
Tampa Bay
Atlanta
Seattle
Arizona

What does give us a chance to be better is continuity and a return of 16 players (some key) from injuries...not our acquisitions.

But what about existing young players taking the next step. Greenlaw, Deebo, dj Jones,Brunskill, Mosely, Moore etc. plus Jimmy G with a full year of experience under his belt. Continuity is critical. Massive amount of players coming off IR? Doesn't any of that count

I'm only assessing talent. The off season is about ADDING talent.

Did we add more talent than lost and did we add more talent to our 3 biggest weaknesses coming into the off season: pass protection, pass defense and pass rush?

That would be an obvious, no.

Every team can say continuity and better health should lead to a better team.

Originally posted by NCommand:
I'm only assessing talent. The off season is about ADDING talent.

Did we add more talent than lost and did we add more talent to our 3 biggest weaknesses coming into the off season: pass protection, pass defense and pass rush?

That would be an obvious, no.

Every team can say continuity and better health should lead to a better team.

I think Trent Williams and Brunskill makes the pass protection better than Staley and Person.
Pass defense. Only CB who could've been an improvement were Okudah and Henderson, neither were in the board. Unfortunately this was a super weak DB class.
Pass rush. If they lost faith in Ford they'd have traded him away, perhaps signed Clowney. Guess they'll give him a chance this season and, if Ford keeps getting hurt, don't be surprised if the first round pick of 2021 is a DE.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Cutitoff:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Definitely not better but cheaper with more long term security. And the 'chance' to be better if all the rookies play up to their expectations.

The next level in this excellent topic and post is to compare our roster to our top competitors as our ultimate goal, is to WIN the Superbowl this time around.

Dallas
Green Bay
Minnesota
Chicago
New Orleans
Tampa Bay
Atlanta
Seattle
Arizona

What does give us a chance to be better is continuity and a return of 16 players (some key) from injuries...not our acquisitions.

But what about existing young players taking the next step. Greenlaw, Deebo, dj Jones,Brunskill, Mosely, Moore etc. plus Jimmy G with a full year of experience under his belt. Continuity is critical. Massive amount of players coming off IR? Doesn't any of that count

I'm only assessing talent. The off season is about ADDING talent.

Did we add more talent than lost and did we add more talent to our 3 biggest weaknesses coming into the off season: pass protection, pass defense and pass rush?

That would be an obvious, no.

Every team can say continuity and better health should lead to a better team.

I guess I am looking at overall improvement, not just because of the draft alone.
But on that note, although sanders was good, he tended to disappear later in games. So I don't think it was as huge a loss as others. As far as Kinlaw, I think he will be more disruptive but less consistent at first. And if we include Trent w as part of draft action, they got better there as far as age and overall health.

Originally posted by richterkbelmont:

I think Trent Williams and Brunskill makes the pass protection better than Staley and Person.
Pass defense. Only CB who could've been an improvement were Okudah and Henderson, neither were in the board. Unfortunately this was a super weak DB class.
Pass rush. If they lost faith in Ford they'd have traded him away, perhaps signed Clowney. Guess they'll give him a chance this season and, if Ford keeps getting hurt, don't be surprised if the first round pick of 2021 is a DE.

Right. I'm not dismissing WHY more talent wasn't had, just the end result of the off season compared to our Superbowl team. Checks and balances.

And like an example you noted in Brunskill, he was here last year so we didn't add talent above him, only behind. In fact, we lost Person, a cheaper player than Compton, well versed in the system and who can play both G and C.

So, in checks and balances, talent was not added. Like Williams for Staley; that's a wash on talent. If TW was added TO an OL with Staley still on it, then you're talking a talent upgrade!

Originally posted by richterkbelmont:

Originally posted by NCommand:
I'm only assessing talent. The off season is about ADDING talent.

Did we add more talent than lost and did we add more talent to our 3 biggest weaknesses coming into the off season: pass protection, pass defense and pass rush?

That would be an obvious, no.

Every team can say continuity and better health should lead to a better team.

I think Trent Williams and Brunskill makes the pass protection better than Staley and Person.
Pass defense. Only CB who could've been an improvement were Okudah and Henderson, neither were in the board. Unfortunately this was a super weak DB class.
Pass rush. If they lost faith in Ford they'd have traded him away, perhaps signed Clowney. Guess they'll give him a chance this season and, if Ford keeps getting hurt, don't be surprised if the first round pick of 2021 is a DE.

I think on offense, with Kyle, you can be assured that the offense will be at least top 10 in talent and will be able to move the ball on any defense. In other words, with Kyle, that offense isn't going to miss a step because we lost Staley.

My worry is always defense. That last Quarter in the super bowl, we didn't have the pass rush we needed to close out that game. We got Kinlaw which is a big step cap-wise. I predicted we couldn't keep that DLine intact but guessed wrong as to who we were going to lose. I thought Armstead was going to be let go, instead it was Buckner. I'd have loved to get a little more DB talent in this years draft, but the draft nerds did say this year's DB crop was not that deep. I'm hoping our DB's we have already on the team develop and/or get healthy and stay healthy this year.

At edge rusher, I'm disappointed that we didn't get Ford's backup in the draft, but hopefully Kocureck can resurrect Kerry Hyder's career and Blair can make a comeback from his knee injury. I think Ford's knee is shot at this point and don't see him contributing past the 5th or 6th game of the regular season. A lot of question marks on the edge rusher position other than Bosa. No team is ever going to be perfect in the age of the Salary Cap, but as a team, I think this team is as complete as any team in the NFC -- enough to make it into the playoffs this year. That's all you need to do, make the playoffs and have a 3 or 4 game win streak - and whalla - 6th Lombardy.

Originally posted by Cutitoff:

I guess I am looking at overall improvement, not just because of the draft alone.
But on that note, although sanders was good, he tended to disappear later in games. So I don't think it was as huge a loss as others. As far as Kinlaw, I think he will be more disruptive but less consistent at first. And if we include Trent w as part of draft action, they got better there as far as age and overall health.

Totally get that...degrees of loss/gain is important to factor in.

Whether we're better or not doesn't matter in April. Gonna be a few months before these guys even get on the field to practice so we may not know the impact of this class until after mid season.

As long as Jimmy gets better, that's all that matters. If he can improve from last season, this team will be in the the SB again next season.