#11: 2nd & 11
Slant/Flat to the left. Double Slants to the right.
vs Cover 1 blitz; 5 rushers (blues), man coverage
Against man coverage, Double Slants works.
It's man coverage. Jimmy takes the snap and looks to the Slant/Flat concept, which is fine if he is looking to target the slant. If Jimmy wants to target the slant, he needs to be more patient for Aiyuk to make his move. Jimmy is not patient and targets the Flat - wrong decision.
+2. Bad read, decent throw. The optimal read is to look to the Double Slants where Bourne is open.
Here is Kyle talking about how you don't target the flat on a slant-flat concept vs man coverage.
https://49ers.pressdemocrat.com/kyle-shanahan-pierre-garcons-pass-interference-coach-run-slant-route/
"...any time you run a man coverage play, guys running to the flat is not a good play for man coverage. It's hard to get open running a flat route. You're just running to the flat. That's usually for zone.
"...when they know it's man and it's a five a man rush, the first thing you're going to look at is can we throw a slant."
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Coaches Film Analysis: 2020 Season
Nov 3, 2020 at 2:09 PM
- thl408
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Nov 3, 2020 at 2:19 PM
- 49AllTheTime
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Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:not really. I don't pretend a Pro football player can run less than ten yards so slow.
Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:how about a safety farther away with a shorter pass distance?
Originally posted by thl408:
Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
except the safety is not flat footed, but the QB is
Here's that play at regular speed.
There's no way anyone can convince me that a QB shouldn't be able to throw a ball, that travels 20 yards, faster than a DB can close 10 yards when not already sprinting.
you can't be serious.
The defender is already in an outright sprint here. And its substantially shorter of a run than in the play in question.
You are being intentionally disingenuous. You know it.
I guess no DB has ever baited a QB before
Nov 3, 2020 at 2:25 PM
- thl408
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#12: 3rd & 9
Red + yellow is the Fade-Out. jd calls this 'Ohio'. Good vs man coverage and Quarters.
Jimmy sees the back of the jerseys of the two blue defenders and confirms it's man coverage. As long as Bourne can win an outside release, that will give Jimmy a window.
+10. Good read, good throw.
Red + yellow is the Fade-Out. jd calls this 'Ohio'. Good vs man coverage and Quarters.
Jimmy sees the back of the jerseys of the two blue defenders and confirms it's man coverage. As long as Bourne can win an outside release, that will give Jimmy a window.
+10. Good read, good throw.
Nov 3, 2020 at 2:37 PM
- Patoranking
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Originally posted by thl408:#10: 3rd & 7
Sail concept to the right (Cover3 buster).
Double Slants to the left (man coverage and Cover2 buster)
SEA shows two deep safeties (MOFO) and will rush 5.
Jimmy takes the snap and correctly looks to the Double Slants. He looks at Bourne first, then Aiyuk (correct, Double Slants is an inside-out read). With no middle deep safety, Bourne should run hard at the red safety's inside hip and force red to cover him. Bourne doesn't run his route with much speed and it allows red to hang over the top of both Bourne and Aiyuk. The better Bourne can occupy red, the more open Aiyuk's slant will be.
Red reading Jimmy's eyes, sees that he is winding up to target Aiyuk.
6. One yard short of the first down. I slowed down the gif to show that the red safety didn't leave Bourne until he knew Jimmy was targeting Aiyuk, but now it's difficult to see that Bourne ran his route slow. Bourne has to show as a threat to attack the middle of the field between the two safeties. Correct read to look at the Double Slants. Perhaps an early throw to Bourne allows him to catch and run for the first down.
Originally posted by thl408:#9: 2nd & 7
Two man Stick to the right. This is good to horizontally stretch a curl/flat defender. SEA will come with an odd playcall and at first I thought it was a blown coverage, but they do it a couple other times in the game. SEA will blitz the two blue defenders along with rushing their 4 DL. Then they will play zone behind it. Usually when teams rush 6, they play man coverage behind it.
Six rushers with 3 deep. That leaves just two underneath zone defenders. Jimmy takes the snap and looks to the two man Stick. Dwelley on a hot route just curls and sits over the middle.
This is like a Fire Zone blitz (3 deep, 3 under), but there is an entire zone not being covered by any defender with Dwelley chillin by himself. Jimmy has to see where the blitz is coming from, and if there is a route designed to go to that area, then look there.
Incomplete. Bad read, bad throw. This is an example of Jimmy making up his mind presnap and not willing to see what happens postsnap. Maybe Bourne makes this catch if he doesn't slip, but the correct mental processing play is to see SEA blitzing two defenders from the same side of the field and understanding that Dwelley will be exploiting the vacated area.
This is a really great breakdown, thanks thl. Very insightful, didn't realize any of this during the game. Anecdotal observation but it seems like Jimmy G these days is almost always going to his primary read.
Sooometimes his 2nd read but not often
When I think back to his 2017 debut, I remember jonnydel breaking down Jimmy going into his 4th and 5th progressions. That + Jimmy looks like a lot more skittish in the pocket. Wonder if the injuries (ACL and now ankle) + generally bad protection the past 2-3 years has led to Jimmy G regressing in his post-snap reads/comfort...
Nov 3, 2020 at 2:40 PM
- Patoranking
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Originally posted by thl408:#10: 3rd & 7
Sail concept to the right (Cover3 buster).
Double Slants to the left (man coverage and Cover2 buster)
SEA shows two deep safeties (MOFO) and will rush 5.
Jimmy takes the snap and correctly looks to the Double Slants. He looks at Bourne first, then Aiyuk (correct, Double Slants is an inside-out read). With no middle deep safety, Bourne should run hard at the red safety's inside hip and force red to cover him. Bourne doesn't run his route with much speed and it allows red to hang over the top of both Bourne and Aiyuk. The better Bourne can occupy red, the more open Aiyuk's slant will be.
Red reading Jimmy's eyes, sees that he is winding up to target Aiyuk.
+6. One yard short of the first down. I slowed down the gif to show that the red safety didn't leave Bourne until he knew Jimmy was targeting Aiyuk, but now it's difficult to see that Bourne ran his route slow. Bourne has to show as a threat to attack the middle of the field between the two safeties. Correct read to look at the Double Slants. Perhaps an early throw to Bourne allows him to catch and run for the first down.
On this one, isn't Bourne turning to look right away because he's the hot receiver as he's running into the area the blitz came from? Ordinarily I'd agree he should've run full speed, but here I think KB might've made the right read and Jimmy read it differently.
Nov 3, 2020 at 2:42 PM
- sacniner
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Thl, props for stepping up.
Maybe Jonny has some life stuff to deal with, if so, by all means we get it. But sucks the week he goes MIA is when Jimmy G probably played his last snaps with our beloved Niners
Maybe Jonny has some life stuff to deal with, if so, by all means we get it. But sucks the week he goes MIA is when Jimmy G probably played his last snaps with our beloved Niners
Nov 3, 2020 at 2:45 PM
- Goatie
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Originally posted by thl408:
#10: 3rd & 7
Sail concept to the right (Cover3 buster).
Double Slants to the left (man coverage and Cover2 buster)
SEA shows two deep safeties (MOFO) and will rush 5.
Jimmy takes the snap and correctly looks to the Double Slants. He looks at Bourne first, then Aiyuk (correct, Double Slants is an inside-out read). With no middle deep safety, Bourne should run hard at the red safety's inside hip and force red to cover him. Bourne doesn't run his route with much speed and it allows red to hang over the top of both Bourne and Aiyuk. The better Bourne can occupy red, the more open Aiyuk's slant will be.
Red reading Jimmy's eyes, sees that he is winding up to target Aiyuk.
+6. One yard short of the first down. I slowed down the gif to show that the red safety didn't leave Bourne until he knew Jimmy was targeting Aiyuk, but now it's difficult to see that Bourne ran his route slow. Bourne has to show as a threat to attack the middle of the field between the two safeties. Correct read to look at the Double Slants. Perhaps an early throw to Bourne allows him to catch and run for the first down.
Although this play worked out sort of okay it shows what a lot of people miss because plays happen so fast. That is if one man (component) does not execute as they are meant to the play can fail or not be as effective.
Too many do not look or know how to look at someone who is not executing their role and then are too quick to draw their pitch forks and sheet blame on the QB for the failure.
Nov 3, 2020 at 2:46 PM
- thl408
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Originally posted by Patoranking:
On this one, isn't Bourne turning to look right away because he's the hot receiver as he's running into the area the blitz came from? Ordinarily I'd agree he should've run full speed, but here I think KB might've made the right read and Jimmy read it differently.
You're right. That is very possible since the blitz occurred right in front of Bourne. And that would explain why he didn't run his route hard. He wanted to quickly present himself as an option, like you said, as the hot read.
Nov 3, 2020 at 3:00 PM
- thl408
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#13: 1st & 15
This is an RPO. Option to handoff to Jet on an outside zone right, or throw it to the Slant-Flat.
6 Blockers (5 OL + TE) vs 7 in the box.
SEA I think is in a Fire Zone Blitz, will blitz the blue slot defender. It's some sort of 3 deep shell coverage.
Jimmy does not handoff to Jet and choose to target the slant-flat. With 7 defenders in the box, the blue CB playing with a cushion on Aiyuk, and a clear passing lane to Aiyuk, I think this is the correct decision.
Juice looks open and a pass to him can most likely be completed but only for a short gain. Jimmy targets Aiyuk. Blue CB squatting on the short throw and will do a good job of jumping the slant.
Incomplete. Could have been pass interference. Decent read. Tip your hat to the defender on this one.
This is an RPO. Option to handoff to Jet on an outside zone right, or throw it to the Slant-Flat.
6 Blockers (5 OL + TE) vs 7 in the box.
SEA I think is in a Fire Zone Blitz, will blitz the blue slot defender. It's some sort of 3 deep shell coverage.
Jimmy does not handoff to Jet and choose to target the slant-flat. With 7 defenders in the box, the blue CB playing with a cushion on Aiyuk, and a clear passing lane to Aiyuk, I think this is the correct decision.
Juice looks open and a pass to him can most likely be completed but only for a short gain. Jimmy targets Aiyuk. Blue CB squatting on the short throw and will do a good job of jumping the slant.
Incomplete. Could have been pass interference. Decent read. Tip your hat to the defender on this one.
Nov 3, 2020 at 3:14 PM
- mutant-man49
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Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:Originally posted by thl408:Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:except the safety is not flat footed, but the QB is
Here's that play at regular speed.
There's no way anyone can convince me that a QB shouldn't be able to throw a ball, that travels 20 yards, faster than a DB can close 10 yards when not already sprinting.
1) when is it ever a 20 yard throw? By the time Jimmy looks back to the right Bourne is already 15 yards down the field. That pass would of had to be bullet between 3 defenders and traveled 25-30 yards.
2) at what point when Jimmy turn back right is the deep safety 10 yards away from Bourne? By the time he turns right Bourne is passing the 10 yard hash with the safety playing at about the 4-5?
It's a throw that is possible if Jim started his read to the 3 receiver side. It's impossible to hit that guy the way he ran the play.
Nov 3, 2020 at 3:18 PM
- mutant-man49
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thl, would you say for the most part Jimmy is making the right reads, he just doesn't trust his protection and that causing him to to through his progressions to quickly?
Nov 3, 2020 at 3:27 PM
- thl408
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#14: 2nd & 15
49ers use double TEs, one to each side to give a look of max protection. SEA will come with that odd coverage I mentioned earlier, rushing 6 (blues) with 3 deep, 2 underneath zones.
This is not a coverage you see often. I don't know if SEA does this every game or if it's just this game. Both Kittle and Dwelley chip block, then release.
As Kittle chip blocked, the underneath defenders drop back into their zones. When Kittle releases into his route, there's a lot of room.
+14. Good read, simple throw. Good play design to give help on protection then release late once the underneath zone defenders get into their drops.
49ers use double TEs, one to each side to give a look of max protection. SEA will come with that odd coverage I mentioned earlier, rushing 6 (blues) with 3 deep, 2 underneath zones.
This is not a coverage you see often. I don't know if SEA does this every game or if it's just this game. Both Kittle and Dwelley chip block, then release.
As Kittle chip blocked, the underneath defenders drop back into their zones. When Kittle releases into his route, there's a lot of room.
+14. Good read, simple throw. Good play design to give help on protection then release late once the underneath zone defenders get into their drops.
Nov 3, 2020 at 3:27 PM
- thl408
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Originally posted by mutant-man49:
thl, would you say for the most part Jimmy is making the right reads, he just doesn't trust his protection and that causing him to to through his progressions to quickly?
I'll can give a better answer when I do dropbacks 15-20.
Nov 3, 2020 at 3:48 PM
- thl408
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#15: 1st & 10
Mirrored Two man Stick. Stick concepts attack the curl/flat defender.
SEA will come with a traditional Fire Zone blitz (3 deep, 3 under)
Jimmy takes the snap and keys the red MIKE. Whichever way red shades towards, read the opposite direction. Red shading towards the strongside.
That means the weakside orange curl/flat defender cannot cover both routes. Jimmy targets Bourne. Pressure in his face doesn't allow him to follow through on the throw.
+3. Good read, bad throw. Bad blitz pickup.
Mirrored Two man Stick. Stick concepts attack the curl/flat defender.
SEA will come with a traditional Fire Zone blitz (3 deep, 3 under)
Jimmy takes the snap and keys the red MIKE. Whichever way red shades towards, read the opposite direction. Red shading towards the strongside.
That means the weakside orange curl/flat defender cannot cover both routes. Jimmy targets Bourne. Pressure in his face doesn't allow him to follow through on the throw.
+3. Good read, bad throw. Bad blitz pickup.
Nov 3, 2020 at 3:51 PM
- Goatie
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Originally posted by thl408:
#15: 1st & 10
Mirrored Two man Stick. Stick concepts attack the curl/flat defender.
SEA will come with a traditional Fire Zone blitz (3 deep, 3 under)
Jimmy takes the snap and keys the red MIKE. Whichever way red shades towards, read the opposite direction. Red shading towards the strongside.
That means the weakside orange curl/flat defender cannot cover both routes. Jimmy targets Bourne. Pressure in his face doesn't allow him to follow through on the throw.
+3. Good read, bad throw. Bad blitz pickup.
It was pretty decisive to pivot left in the face of that defender and get the ball away. He copped a big hit for his efforts.