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SAN FRANCISCO 49ERS at ARIZONA CARDINALS - 2020 Week 16

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SAN FRANCISCO 49ERS at ARIZONA CARDINALS - 2020 Week 16

Originally posted by dhp318:
Originally posted by 49ers81:
Sorry, have to disagree. They clearly were not in sync in that first game which I attribute to not having had a typical camp. I don't have the issues with Jimmy that a lot of people do so I will have to disagree on that point. It was tough losing Buckner but if Ford and Bosa are both healthy with the addition of Hyder and Kinlaw that unit is probably still pretty good. Alexander was moved midseason or so which moves Greenlaw into the starting line-up full time which is a plus. Kittle and Samuel were out most of the year and Ayiuk is an upgrade over Pettis and Goodwin and Verrett was better than just about anyone they had there last year. Richburg, Garland Brunskill all out at various times so that they are forced to start Skule at guard. No, I don't think I am the one with their head in the sand,

I never said the DL unit wasn't decent, I said it wasn't a position of supreme strength like it was last year when it dominated opposing offensive lines.

"if Ford and Bosa are both healthy"
Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. Fool me three times, shame on...? The fact that fans cling onto hope that Ford is going to be healthy is just bizarre and the clearest example of fans just putting on their blinders.

It's nice to focus on the positives and all, but pointing out improvements means nothing. Teams have to get better at every position each year because football teams are constantly declining. For every addition there is subtraction, so you have to look at the bigger overall NET picture. In 2021, we will still be significantly worse than the 2019 team. The only positions I would expect to be better are the WR position, with the LB and TE position being about the same (2021 draft picks notwithstanding). Otherwise, the team is probably worse at every other position.

And you know this how? Aside from switching Buckner for Kinlaw, who may possess his own kind of strengths, how exactly is the team worse at every position. You don't even know who is going to be on the 2021 team yet. For the sake of argument let's say that Jimmy is still here, so the QB position remains the same. The question there is who the primary back-up will be. Beathard's a FA, Mullen's may be still recovering from surgery and Rosen is an unknown at this point. Given that their back-ups have won something like 9 games over the last three years it seems like just about anyone could be an upgrade there.

Juice has said he wants to stay and won't necessarily be making the decision on how much they are willing to pay him. Primary backs were Coleman, Breida and Mostert. Mostert will still be here, Wilson will probably still be here and Hasty will be here. Jury is out on whether Coleman and McKinnon return but even if they go I'm not sure the backs that remain would be a significant downgrade from 2019.

I will take a leap of faith and say that Richburg comes back along with Garland and Brunskill. I think Tomlinson is still under contract and McKivitz will have a year of experience under his belt and, hopefully as is the case with all of their rookies this year a full training camp not marred by a worldwide pandemic. They could very well draft someone who might be an upgrade at right guard. The big question mark is whether Williams will choose to stay. If he does then the line is at least no worse than it was in 19 and maybe slightly better.

I am not convinced Jordan Reed will stick around but if he does that unit is definitely better. And, as you noted, the receiving corps is better and might even be exceptional if Hurd comes back and fulfills some of that promise he has flashed.

The defensive line will be helped by Bosa's return and Kinlaw's added experience. The other questions to be answered relate to who will actually still be on the team. Ford may finally be healthy, and no, I'm not clinging onto anything in regard to Ford just saying that he will be a factor if he could actually get through a full season, but if not perhaps Hyder comes back. He would certainly be an upgrade over Ford if for no other reason than he has managed to stay on the field. Jones may go but he is another guy who seems to have missed more games than he has played so it may be his fate to move on to some other team where he will end up being a star. However in terms of actual production Givens is probably not much of a downgrade and they have Daniels as well. So that is an incomplete as compared with 2019, with a definite chance to be at least as good if everyone is healthy.

Warner and Greenlaw are probably one of the best LB combos in the league and Al-Shaair is a decent third so that unit is as good or better as 2019.

Sherman was terrific in 2019, but Verrett is a better corner at this stage of their careers so how that unit will compare will depend on whether or not they can bring him back. Ward will still be here but Tartt will probably be gone and people are free to argue whether or not Moore will be better or worse in that position. Moseley I think is a restricted free agent so there is a good chance he will return and Whitherspoon remains a question mark. He is pretty good when his head is on straight, he just can't seem to keep his confidence up. Williams is the best slot corner in the league so how that unit will compare to 2019 largely depends on whether he Verrett and Moseley return. If all three come back than that unit is probably as good or slightly better than 2019, with the elusive Tim Harris being another wild card. Is he even on the team anymore? Then of course the other wildcard is whether or not Saleh sticks around , doubtful I guess, and who takes over his spot and how that effects the overall play of the defense.

It is ridiculous to say that a team has to get "better at every position each year". It's a nice theory but in the age of salary caps and free agency it isn't really practical. Seems to me it's more of a question of recognizing your priorities and making sure you have the core group of guys you need and then work the rest of the roster around them to the best of your ability. Lynch and Shanahan's mantra has been that they are always looking to improve and I suspect they will make every effort to do so. So no, I don't agree at all that the team will be worse off next year. I don't imagine the team will be very active in the FA market with so many of their own guys they would like to bring back but I read somewhere that they may end up with as many as nine picks in the draft and could very well find some upgrades there. So no, I don't agree at all that the team will be worse off next year. If they can stay healthy I would expect them to be a very competitive team.
Originally posted by socalfan21:
Originally posted by billbird2111:
Do not be fooled by the performances we witnessed in Saturday's win. Do not be fooled if this team jumps up and delivers a whopping to the Seahawks. Enjoy it, yes. But don't be fooled by it.

Akello playing like a real CB? Linemen suddenly holding blocks and protecting the QB? These guys are playing for new contracts. You're going to see effort and flash out of this team you haven't seen for awhile.

But don't be fooled by it. Key members of this squad have underperformed all season. Remember that. Kyle and John will. You should too. Wins are nice. But don't let it deter you from the work that still must be done.

In case you need a reminder, the KC Chiefs are going back to the playoffs and are the odds on favorite to win another Super Bowl.

The 49ers aren't going anywhere.

Next seasons team will look nothing like this seasons team so I don't exactly know what you are implying. They're most likely going to back to the playoffs and be a super bowl contender. Correct 2020 49ers aren't going anywhere

I wouldn't assume this team is going back to the playoffs. Not at all. Not next season. I certainly hope they do, but a lot has to go right.
Originally posted by paulk205:
My point was that for every Stafford there is a Couch, or even Bradford (OK but not "generational"). The risk of injury or busting out is so high that a few picks up of down in the same year are not statistically significant. Over a course of many years, sure, the #1 pick is more valuable that the #2, and the #7 more than the #15. But in the same year the difference is not so big as to rise above the volatility of draft success or failure.

One final comment. There was a mention that the Jets at #2 are definitely a lose-lose because they could have traded back for a king's ransom if they didn't want Lawrence. But this is a fallacy: a 0-16 Jets (to ensure the #1 pick) would have to pick Lawrence no matter what - the pressure from the NY media if nothing else would have been too immense to take the risk of trading back. So, even if they thought that Darnold is decent and possible to develop they would have to move on. Now, Lawrence may be as good as Aikman or Manning proved to be. I hope so, for his own sake - I like people succeeding. But it is not impossible that he gets injured, busts out or is merely Bradford-like. It's possible. But the Jets at #2 can keep Darnold and trade back for a king's ransom to the panicky teams wishing to get in on the rest of the possible "franchise" QBs. Or they can just (hope to) get a very good player at #2 and improve their team.

This media BS about this being an epic fail just sells ads to sports shows and newspapers. But as sports analysis is weak.

And the bottom line is that we, the sports fans, the buyers of the product, should be happy that teams play hard all the time and don't tank. Would you really be interested in a league where teams throw games, even if it's for picks? It slants the competition: the same teams played hard from Week 1 to 8 and now they're throwing games? Then those opponents drawing them in Week 16 have an advantage over the opponents of Week 5. You really don't want this to happen in your league. You should be thankful everyone is a professional and forget about "generational talents".

I remember the 6-9 49ers knocking off the Broncos in the last game of the 2006 season, keeping them out of the playoffs. In Denver, in the snow. Disaster - we only got to pick Patrick Willis next year.

Injuries aren't even as big of a concern as they were back in the day. Nowadays you can barely touch a QB and just about every injury can be overcome within a year. It's not 1982 anymore. I do agree quality varies every year though. You don't always get LeBron in the NBA either. Some years that pick is worthless. But this year the quality is there and that's the point. NY absolutely has the option to trade it. The media can churp all they want but end of the day it means nothing. If the next coach says he's behind Darnold and trades away the pick they'll get over it especially after getting those picks.

But I did say I earlier that I wasn't referring to us here. Beating down a division rival in need of a win for a playoff spot carries more weight than a few pick drop. We play that team twice next year. I got no problem with Shanny flexing on them as a reminder that next year we'll be at full health and you can't beat us now.
[ Edited by tjd808185 on Dec 28, 2020 at 1:30 PM ]
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