Punters

Hi all. I'm relatively new to the forum, and relatively new to American Football being that I'm from Scotland.

Wanted to get a bit of insight into punting in general. As I understand it, if the ball stays in play from a punt and the receiving team don't either catch or collect the ball, the play continues with the line of scrimmage from the point it settles (unless there's a fair catch called). If the ball goes out of play, the line of scrimmage is at the point where it crosses the line. If it crosses the end zone it goes back to the 20 yd line. That raises two questions from me (and maybe more to follow):

1. Why don't punters aim for the sidelines more? I realise you can't get quite the same distance (Pythagoras eh), but at least it's a sure thing. Keep it in play, then defence have an opportunity to return. Sure, it's maybe a harder punt, but rugby players kick to touch all the time on a bigger pitch.
2. Sometimes on a really deep punt that looks like it'll settle within the 10 yd line, you see the defence group around and wait for it to settle rather than collecting it and trying to return it up the field. It often seems like if they collected the ball on say the 2 yd line, they'd still perhaps get it to the 10yd line. Is it simply a case of wanting to avoid a fumble? Are they waiting on the off chance it tumbles into the end zone?

Thanks

Originally posted by Illgresi:
Hi all. I'm relatively new to the forum, and relatively new to American Football being that I'm from Scotland.

Wanted to get a bit of insight into punting in general. As I understand it, if the ball stays in play from a punt and the receiving team don't either catch or collect the ball, the play continues with the line of scrimmage from the point it settles (unless there's a fair catch called). If the ball goes out of play, the line of scrimmage is at the point where it crosses the line. If it crosses the end zone it goes back to the 20 yd line. That raises two questions from me (and maybe more to follow):

1. Why don't punters aim for the sidelines more? I realise you can't get quite the same distance (Pythagoras eh), but at least it's a sure thing. Keep it in play, then defence have an opportunity to return. Sure, it's maybe a harder punt, but rugby players kick to touch all the time on a bigger pitch.
2. Sometimes on a really deep punt that looks like it'll settle within the 10 yd line, you see the defence group around and wait for it to settle rather than collecting it and trying to return it up the field. It often seems like if they collected the ball on say the 2 yd line, they'd still perhaps get it to the 10yd line. Is it simply a case of wanting to avoid a fumble? Are they waiting on the off chance it tumbles into the end zone?

Thanks

First of all welcome to the forum, its nice to see fans from around the world on here. To answer your questions:

1. Not sure why they dont do that often, my guess is the difficulty and the refs are crap and cant nail exactly where it goes out correctly.
2. Yes and Yes.

From a Brazilian used to soccer: It is much harder to kick the footbal with that acurracy. The american football is made to be passed. Also the hang time is very important too, aiming for the sidelines while kicking with a high arc is not easy at all

Originally posted by Fresno49er:

Originally posted by Illgresi:
Hi all. I'm relatively new to the forum, and relatively new to American Football being that I'm from Scotland.

Wanted to get a bit of insight into punting in general. As I understand it, if the ball stays in play from a punt and the receiving team don't either catch or collect the ball, the play continues with the line of scrimmage from the point it settles (unless there's a fair catch called). If the ball goes out of play, the line of scrimmage is at the point where it crosses the line. If it crosses the end zone it goes back to the 20 yd line. That raises two questions from me (and maybe more to follow):

1. Why don't punters aim for the sidelines more? I realise you can't get quite the same distance (Pythagoras eh), but at least it's a sure thing. Keep it in play, then defence have an opportunity to return. Sure, it's maybe a harder punt, but rugby players kick to touch all the time on a bigger pitch.
2. Sometimes on a really deep punt that looks like it'll settle within the 10 yd line, you see the defence group around and wait for it to settle rather than collecting it and trying to return it up the field. It often seems like if they collected the ball on say the 2 yd line, they'd still perhaps get it to the 10yd line. Is it simply a case of wanting to avoid a fumble? Are they waiting on the off chance it tumbles into the end zone?

Thanks

First of all welcome to the forum, its nice to see fans from around the world on here. To answer your questions:

1. Not sure why they dont do that often, my guess is the difficulty and the refs are crap and cant nail exactly where it goes out correctly.
2. Yes and Yes.

Thanks Fresno49er, appreciate your reply. Struggle to see how the line refs can't get the correct position. Between the Down Judge and the Field Judge you would expect them to have a good view. Then you add in TV replay etc.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=16LwVZbzMX0

In rugby players aim to kick for touch frequently. They usually do it at pace, and occasionally fail. Makes for an exciting game though!

Welcome! Ya it's mostly due to the fact that refs can't exactly see where the ball goes out, it becomes more of a guess.

But pm the user Chez. He used to be a punter in college and can tell you all about it.

Welcome to the zone. Nice to see more international fans around. It's a really good fandom (just stay clear of Quarterback opinions) and you won't find a better forum anywhere than this one.

In my country (Oz) the term punter is used for some one who gambles i.e. "takes a punt on....." Ironic really. Oche aye!

1. As I understand it, kicking it out of bounds (coffin kicking) has fallen out of favor being replaced by the Australian rules football style of kicking called the end over end punt. It's considered to be more effective. Some punters still coffin kick but it's not common anymore.

2. it's not worth the risk of fumbling… footballs are hard to get your hands on when they're tumbling around on the ground. If the receiving team so much as touches it then it's a live ball. Coach would teach us not to go near the punted ball unless it was almost a 100% sure thing we could safely pick it up.

Originally posted by KeepRabbitsOut:
Welcome to the zone. Nice to see more international fans around. It's a really good fandom (just stay clear of Quarterback opinions) and you won't find a better forum anywhere than this one.

In my country (Oz) the term punter is used for some one who gambles i.e. "takes a punt on....." Ironic really. Oche aye!

Never heard punt used as a description for taking a gamble before.

Originally posted by mod:

Originally posted by KeepRabbitsOut:
Welcome to the zone. Nice to see more international fans around. It's a really good fandom (just stay clear of Quarterback opinions) and you won't find a better forum anywhere than this one.

In my country (Oz) the term punter is used for some one who gambles i.e. "takes a punt on....." Ironic really. Oche aye!

Never heard punt used as a description for taking a gamble before.

Yes and a few other links to Britain, Rugby and one I found that our Scottish thread starter may know.

What is a punter in Scotland?

A punter is someone who sells drugs, or if used in another context also someone who is buying drugs (normally plural here). Also used as meaning someone who places bets on horses or dogs. stoatin - drunk, but can also mean stoned on one or another drugs, although this is less common.

Welcome from the other side of the border. Ex-Claymores fan?

Originally posted by KeepRabbitsOut:

Originally posted by mod:

Originally posted by KeepRabbitsOut:
Welcome to the zone. Nice to see more international fans around. It's a really good fandom (just stay clear of Quarterback opinions) and you won't find a better forum anywhere than this one.

In my country (Oz) the term punter is used for some one who gambles i.e. "takes a punt on....." Ironic really. Oche aye!

Never heard punt used as a description for taking a gamble before.

Yes and a few other links to Britain, Rugby and one I found that our Scottish thread starter may know.

What is a punter in Scotland?

A punter is someone who sells drugs, or if used in another context also someone who is buying drugs (normally plural here). Also used as meaning someone who places bets on horses or dogs. stoatin - drunk, but can also mean stoned on one or another drugs, although this is less common.

As an American, the only other use for the word 'punt' was a city or some outpost that was a trading partner of Egypt a long time ago, often referred to as 'The Land of Punt'.

Now I know it can mean 'to take a risk', 'to sell (or buy) drugs', or 'kicking a ball to the other team in American Football typically on fourth down', Interesting. I always wondered why we called this kick a 'punt' and where it came from, can anyone answer that one? lol

And welcome to the forum! These fine lads before me answered your questions perfectly. And heed what KeepRabbitsOut said, steer clear of the QB threads and you'll love it here.

Hi, I'm English and love this sport and this team.

Are you familiar with Jamie Gillian? Scottish punter for the Browns, has a good story, former rugby player.

These guys have answered this well but I think the blame lies with the Coaches & Co-Ordinators. The Giants had a punter in the 90's Jeff Feagles who was an All Pro and specialized in the "Coffin" corner punt.

There are several guys from Australia with Rugby and Aussie Rules backgrounds who have the skill to pull the corner punt off.

There is risk, it takes longer to aim to the corner which increases the block risk and you kick away from half of your punt coverage giving greater chance of a return.

I believe the coaches should coach around this, put your better coverage and blocking guys to the side you're aiming, snap slightly to that side to reduce the time to kick. Practice it as a unit.

Bring this element of the game back.

Originally posted by KeepRabbitsOut:
Yes and a few other links to Britain, Rugby and one I found that our Scottish thread starter may know.

What is a punter in Scotland?

A punter is someone who sells drugs, or if used in another context also someone who is buying drugs (normally plural here). Also used as meaning someone who places bets on horses or dogs. stoatin - drunk, but can also mean stoned on one or another drugs, although this is less common.

The main usage of the word here tends to either be in relation to rugby, or battering any ball as hard, high, and far as you can. It is also used in the sense of 'take a punt' when you try something unlikely to be successful (e.g. gambling).

It is also a type of boat of course. Also the former currency of our dear neighbours from the emerald isle.

Originally posted by English:
Welcome from the other side of the border. Ex-Claymores fan?

Not really mate. I only started following American football with any sort of regularity about 5 years ago when my now wife bought us tickets to Wembley. Think it was the Jags vs Bills. Was cheering on the Bills in that one as I have family in upstate NY, but I could never support them full time. Being an Aberdeen fan I couldn't support a team that plays in blue, white, and red!

Originally posted by ElDannMann:
As an American, the only other use for the word 'punt' was a city or some outpost that was a trading partner of Egypt a long time ago, often referred to as 'The Land of Punt'.

Now I know it can mean 'to take a risk', 'to sell (or buy) drugs', or 'kicking a ball to the other team in American Football typically on fourth down', Interesting. I always wondered why we called this kick a 'punt' and where it came from, can anyone answer that one? lol

And welcome to the forum! These fine lads before me answered your questions perfectly. And heed what KeepRabbitsOut said, steer clear of the QB threads and you'll love it here.

Is there some sort of controversy about QBs at the moment?

Originally posted by Illgresi:

Originally posted by ElDannMann:
As an American, the only other use for the word 'punt' was a city or some outpost that was a trading partner of Egypt a long time ago, often referred to as 'The Land of Punt'.

Now I know it can mean 'to take a risk', 'to sell (or buy) drugs', or 'kicking a ball to the other team in American Football typically on fourth down', Interesting. I always wondered why we called this kick a 'punt' and where it came from, can anyone answer that one? lol

And welcome to the forum! These fine lads before me answered your questions perfectly. And heed what KeepRabbitsOut said, steer clear of the QB threads and you'll love it here.

Is there some sort of controversy about QBs at the moment?

Haha, the problem isn't so much the QB "controversy"; it's more so the bickering back and forth about things that don't matter, lol

Originally posted by ElDannMann:
As an American, the only other use for the word 'punt' was a city or some outpost that was a trading partner of Egypt a long time ago, often referred to as 'The Land of Punt'.

Now I know it can mean 'to take a risk', 'to sell (or buy) drugs', or 'kicking a ball to the other team in American Football typically on fourth down', Interesting. I always wondered why we called this kick a 'punt' and where it came from, can anyone answer that one? lol

And welcome to the forum! These fine lads before me answered your questions perfectly. And heed what KeepRabbitsOut said, steer clear of the QB threads and you'll love it here.

1845 the term was used in Rugby. Came from the Midlands in Britain from the word "bunt" which means to push or hit/kick the ball away, Baseball may have picked it up too?