Offseason strategy - how would you play it?

Originally posted by Joecool:
The main reason to play cover 3 is so that you don't need to over pay or over reach at the CB position. Unless you have a Deon Sanders, you will always be over paying for a player at position that will give up big plays. Look at Ramsey. The position is just impossible to play in this era, so why commit the draft pick or money. Stick with the taller "slower" CBs that you can get later in the draft.

Our most important need on defense are the Safety positions since we are set solid on our front 7.

Our second biggest need is to score more points. Be a team that scores 30/game. That will take care of our defense. Get that OL and one WR that can break a TD from anywhere on the field.

I think pass defense is a combination of pass rush and pass defense. 49ers have begun to invest again in the defensive back position - and it's paid off for them this past year. I look for the 49ers to continue to shore up that pass defense - possibly with a DLine pick early in day 1 or day 2 and maybe a cornerback in Day 2 or day 3. But I don't think they can get away with slow zone cornerbacks in the defensive backfield nowadays with the kind of mobile QB's that the 49ers have to deal with in the NFC west and in the playoffs.

Originally posted by Joecool:
The main reason to play cover 3 is so that you don't need to over pay or over reach at the CB position. Unless you have a Deon Sanders, you will always be over paying for a player at position that will give up big plays. Look at Ramsey. The position is just impossible to play in this era, so why commit the draft pick or money. Stick with the taller "slower" CBs that you can get later in the draft.

Our most important need on defense are the Safety positions since we are set solid on our front 7.

Our second biggest need is to score more points. Be a team that scores 30/game. That will take care of our defense. Get that OL and one WR that can break a TD from anywhere on the field.

What you said about Cover3 makes sense, but the 49ers defense isn't centered around Cover3 like they were in the past (2017/2018). The offseason chatter in 2021 had Demeco Ryans talking about being more aggressive with pressing the WRs at the line. They drafted two CBs with ideal builds in Lenoir and Ambry, unlike Witherspoon, Tim Harris, TMoore (who they drafted to convert to CB) - all 6'2 guys. Those days are gone.

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by Joecool:
The main reason to play cover 3 is so that you don't need to over pay or over reach at the CB position. Unless you have a Deon Sanders, you will always be over paying for a player at position that will give up big plays. Look at Ramsey. The position is just impossible to play in this era, so why commit the draft pick or money. Stick with the taller "slower" CBs that you can get later in the draft.

Our most important need on defense are the Safety positions since we are set solid on our front 7.

Our second biggest need is to score more points. Be a team that scores 30/game. That will take care of our defense. Get that OL and one WR that can break a TD from anywhere on the field.

What you said about Cover3 makes sense, but the 49ers defense isn't centered around Cover3 like they were in the past (2017/2018). The offseason chatter in 2021 had Demeco Ryans talking about being more aggressive with pressing the WRs at the line. They drafted two CBs with ideal builds in Lenoir and Ambry, unlike Witherspoon, Tim Harris, TMoore (who they drafted to convert to CB) - all 6'2 guys. Those days are gone.

I know. I'm just saying that because the money and draft stock need to go somewhere and I don't believe CB should be one. In this era, CBS are going to get completed on. But if the strategy is to throw off the timing with getting corners that are great at the LOS, then maybe we go away from big safeties and put corner-like build at the Safety spots. That's why Ward is having success. No need for big hits anymore. Our front 4 is able to stuff the run, so no need for that SS.

Tampa 2 might make a comeback with a FS at MLB. But that's IF your front 4 is strong vs the run. It's essentially a cover 3 with your corners covering the flat.

Wasn't Tampa 2 designed due to psd heavy offenses like the K Gun, WCO, and the run and shoot or other single back offenses? Their DLine was the reason why it worked so well.

Originally posted by Joecool:

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by Joecool:
The main reason to play cover 3 is so that you don't need to over pay or over reach at the CB position. Unless you have a Deon Sanders, you will always be over paying for a player at position that will give up big plays. Look at Ramsey. The position is just impossible to play in this era, so why commit the draft pick or money. Stick with the taller "slower" CBs that you can get later in the draft.

Our most important need on defense are the Safety positions since we are set solid on our front 7.

Our second biggest need is to score more points. Be a team that scores 30/game. That will take care of our defense. Get that OL and one WR that can break a TD from anywhere on the field.

What you said about Cover3 makes sense, but the 49ers defense isn't centered around Cover3 like they were in the past (2017/2018). The offseason chatter in 2021 had Demeco Ryans talking about being more aggressive with pressing the WRs at the line. They drafted two CBs with ideal builds in Lenoir and Ambry, unlike Witherspoon, Tim Harris, TMoore (who they drafted to convert to CB) - all 6'2 guys. Those days are gone.

I know. I'm just saying that because the money and draft stock need to go somewhere and I don't believe CB should be one. In this era, CBS are going to get completed on. But if the strategy is to throw off the timing with getting corners that are great at the LOS, then maybe we go away from big safeties and put corner-like build at the Safety spots. That's why Ward is having success. No need for big hits anymore. Our front 4 is able to stuff the run, so no need for that SS.

Tampa 2 might make a comeback with a FS at MLB. But that's IF your front 4 is strong vs the run. It's essentially a cover 3 with your corners covering the flat.

I completely agree with big safeties being a dying breed in the immediate future. Right now, the general league trend is trying to defend the run from a two high shell so that those safeties can help with coverage. That makes safeties that can cover more important than enforcer safeties.
The team has placed a clear emphasis in building the front7 while putting less importance into the DBs. I think there needs to be some balance now that Kris Kocurek has been amazing at getting the most out of the DL. They got two young CBs to develop, the safety group can use some attention with Ward going into his last year of his contract and Tartt a free agent.

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by Joecool:
The main reason to play cover 3 is so that you don't need to over pay or over reach at the CB position. Unless you have a Deon Sanders, you will always be over paying for a player at position that will give up big plays. Look at Ramsey. The position is just impossible to play in this era, so why commit the draft pick or money. Stick with the taller "slower" CBs that you can get later in the draft.

Our most important need on defense are the Safety positions since we are set solid on our front 7.

Our second biggest need is to score more points. Be a team that scores 30/game. That will take care of our defense. Get that OL and one WR that can break a TD from anywhere on the field.

What you said about Cover3 makes sense, but the 49ers defense isn't centered around Cover3 like they were in the past (2017/2018). The offseason chatter in 2021 had Demeco Ryans talking about being more aggressive with pressing the WRs at the line. They drafted two CBs with ideal builds in Lenoir and Ambry, unlike Witherspoon, Tim Harris, TMoore (who they drafted to convert to CB) - all 6'2 guys. Those days are gone.

I'm all for drafting/getting free agent athletic man corners. I think it helps the zone safeties and it helps to be able to change up the coverages on some of these elite passers (Stafford and Wilson for example). You give Stafford or Wilson the same coverage every down, you are just asking to be dinked and dunked to death.

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by Joecool:

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by Joecool:
The main reason to play cover 3 is so that you don't need to over pay or over reach at the CB position. Unless you have a Deon Sanders, you will always be over paying for a player at position that will give up big plays. Look at Ramsey. The position is just impossible to play in this era, so why commit the draft pick or money. Stick with the taller "slower" CBs that you can get later in the draft.

Our most important need on defense are the Safety positions since we are set solid on our front 7.

Our second biggest need is to score more points. Be a team that scores 30/game. That will take care of our defense. Get that OL and one WR that can break a TD from anywhere on the field.

What you said about Cover3 makes sense, but the 49ers defense isn't centered around Cover3 like they were in the past (2017/2018). The offseason chatter in 2021 had Demeco Ryans talking about being more aggressive with pressing the WRs at the line. They drafted two CBs with ideal builds in Lenoir and Ambry, unlike Witherspoon, Tim Harris, TMoore (who they drafted to convert to CB) - all 6'2 guys. Those days are gone.

I know. I'm just saying that because the money and draft stock need to go somewhere and I don't believe CB should be one. In this era, CBS are going to get completed on. But if the strategy is to throw off the timing with getting corners that are great at the LOS, then maybe we go away from big safeties and put corner-like build at the Safety spots. That's why Ward is having success. No need for big hits anymore. Our front 4 is able to stuff the run, so no need for that SS.

Tampa 2 might make a comeback with a FS at MLB. But that's IF your front 4 is strong vs the run. It's essentially a cover 3 with your corners covering the flat.

I completely agree with big safeties being a dying breed in the immediate future. Right now, the general league trend is trying to defend the run from a two high shell so that those safeties can help with coverage. That makes safeties that can cover more important than enforcer safeties.
The team has placed a clear emphasis in building the front7 while putting less importance into the DBs. I think there needs to be some balance now that Kris Kocurek has been amazing at getting the most out of the DL. They got two young CBs to develop, the safety group can use some attention with Ward going into his last year of his contract and Tartt a free agent.

LFG! 4 DBs that are all cornerback capable. MLB that's like a SS to switch so that we can play a cover 3 hybrid but it is actually cover 3 and cover 2 at the same time. CBs play on the LOS to bump the receivers' timing and they get C2 responsibility after that. MLB sprints back into cover 3 like Tua did on that last play against GB. The Safeties split into cover 2 responsibility.

Apologies for the long post, synopsis at the bottom. This is a thought experiment, I'm not going back to edit, so if the numbers don't balance...something has to change. So here's what I would do (the figures are all cap space; all new contract values are total guesses):

Trades:

Garoppolo for best pick available or M Fitzpatrick from Steelers

= +$20M cap (assuming trade)

Contracts:

Restructure Armstead and Ward = +$16M

Deal in Bosa and Deebo = -$25M (total guess)

Total space (so far) = $14M

Our FA:

Tomlinson - Keep ($6.5M)
Verrett - Release (-$5.5M)
Jones - Keep ($4M)
Mostert - Short deal ($3M)
Williams - Short deal ($2.5M)
J Wilson - Short deal ($2M)
Dwelley - Release (-$1.6M)
Norman - Bye bye (-$1.5M)
Harris - Release (-$1.2M)
Sanu - Release (-$1.1M)
Tartt - Depends if we trade for M Fitzpatrick. If so, 1 year take it or leave it. Otherwise, 2 years. (-$1.1M)
T Wilson - Release (-$1.1M)
Compton - Release (-$1.1M)
Johnson - Release (-$1.1M)
Hurst - Short deal ($1.2M)
Key - Keep ($1.2M)
Willis - Keep ($1M)
Sherfield - Release (-$0.9M)
Cannon - Release (-$0.9M)
Brunskill - Keep (-$0.8M)
Brendel - Keep (-$0.8M)
Street - Keep (-$0.8M)
Flannigan-Fowles - Release (-$0.7M)
Hasty - Short deal ($0.7M) Like the wee lad
Jennings - Keep ($3M)
James - Release (-$0.6M)
Al-Shaair - Keep ($4M)
Givens - Release (-$0.5M)

Total space = $7.8M + $14M = $21.8M

Sign FA:

I love the way we play with minimal blitz and only chasing the QB with the DL, but I think an OLB that is an edge rush specialist would be a massive weapon for changing things up. Also, I'm far more comfortable taking a CB from FA than the draft.

Haason Reddick = $8M
J.C. Jackson = $6M
Mike Williams = $7M

Total space = $0.8M

Draft:

I've only taken up watching the NFL in the past few years, so I have zero knowledge of the college players coming through. As such I'll just give a list of priorities imo.

2nd = OL
3rd-5th = TE, OL, S
6th-7th = RB, FB, P

Cap hit assumption = $6M

Overall = -$5.2M

Synopsis

Trade JG for Fitzpatrick

Restructure Armstead and Ward

Pay Deebo and Bosa

The $5.2M negative left from above is nothing in NFL terms, and is probably not all that accurate anyway.I'm confident this scenario could work.

I don't personally feel that CB is a position you want to take a gamble with on the draft. I'd rather fill positions of need in the FA.

I think Ebukam really showed up in the post-season, so I'm happy running with him opposite Bosa. I think bringing in Haason Reddick would provide a serious extra threat to the opposition QB.

We clearly need a CB and Jackson posted great numbers.

Switching to Lance as QB leaves us looking at a bit more of a pass oriented game. I think to accomplish that we need an extra WR an Williams is that man for me.

Resign DJ Jones. Tomlinson bring back for right deal 2 or 3 yrs. 1yr deal for Mostert. Arden Key if they can sign him 2 or 3 yr deal at OK $$. It would be nice to see Trent Sherfield for 1 more yr with a different QB. Bring back the RFA and let the rest walk. Verrett no thanks he most likely will not play most of the year and 17 game zero chance that happens. If there is a free agent CB out there that they an bring in great. J.C. Jackson would be awesome but at what cost? They need to start drafting some CB earlier in the draft and keep drafting OL earlier in the draft. I would draft all CB and OL, with a 5th, or 6th round LB for depth. Use the 7th rounder on WR and CB that can develop.

Win the 6th already dangit!

Originally posted by Illgresi:
Apologies for the long post, synopsis at the bottom. This is a thought experiment, I'm not going back to edit, so if the numbers don't balance...something has to change. So here's what I would do (the figures are all cap space; all new contract values are total guesses):

Trades:

Garoppolo for best pick available or M Fitzpatrick from Steelers

= +$20M cap (assuming trade)

Contracts:

Restructure Armstead and Ward = +$16M

Deal in Bosa and Deebo = -$25M (total guess)

Total space (so far) = $14M

Our FA:

Tomlinson - Keep ($6.5M)
Verrett - Release (-$5.5M)
Jones - Keep ($4M)
Mostert - Short deal ($3M)
Williams - Short deal ($2.5M)
J Wilson - Short deal ($2M)
Dwelley - Release (-$1.6M)
Norman - Bye bye (-$1.5M)
Harris - Release (-$1.2M)
Sanu - Release (-$1.1M)
Tartt - Depends if we trade for M Fitzpatrick. If so, 1 year take it or leave it. Otherwise, 2 years. (-$1.1M)
T Wilson - Release (-$1.1M)
Compton - Release (-$1.1M)
Johnson - Release (-$1.1M)
Hurst - Short deal ($1.2M)
Key - Keep ($1.2M)
Willis - Keep ($1M)
Sherfield - Release (-$0.9M)
Cannon - Release (-$0.9M)
Brunskill - Keep (-$0.8M)
Brendel - Keep (-$0.8M)
Street - Keep (-$0.8M)
Flannigan-Fowles - Release (-$0.7M)
Hasty - Short deal ($0.7M) Like the wee lad
Jennings - Keep ($3M)
James - Release (-$0.6M)
Al-Shaair - Keep ($4M)
Givens - Release (-$0.5M)

Total space = $7.8M + $14M = $21.8M

Sign FA:

I love the way we play with minimal blitz and only chasing the QB with the DL, but I think an OLB that is an edge rush specialist would be a massive weapon for changing things up. Also, I'm far more comfortable taking a CB from FA than the draft.

Haason Reddick = $8M
J.C. Jackson = $6M
Mike Williams = $7M

Total space = $0.8M

Draft:

I've only taken up watching the NFL in the past few years, so I have zero knowledge of the college players coming through. As such I'll just give a list of priorities imo.

2nd = OL
3rd-5th = TE, OL, S
6th-7th = RB, FB, P

Cap hit assumption = $6M

Overall = -$5.2M

Synopsis

Trade JG for Fitzpatrick

Restructure Armstead and Ward

Pay Deebo and Bosa

The $5.2M negative left from above is nothing in NFL terms, and is probably not all that accurate anyway.I'm confident this scenario could work.

I don't personally feel that CB is a position you want to take a gamble with on the draft. I'd rather fill positions of need in the FA.

I think Ebukam really showed up in the post-season, so I'm happy running with him opposite Bosa. I think bringing in Haason Reddick would provide a serious extra threat to the opposition QB.

We clearly need a CB and Jackson posted great numbers.

Switching to Lance as QB leaves us looking at a bit more of a pass oriented game. I think to accomplish that we need an extra WR an Williams is that man for me.

No way in hell is JC Jackson getting 6 mil lol

Originally posted by FredFlintstone:
No way in hell is JC Jackson getting 6 mil lol

Those FA signings are totally unrealistic. I wouldn't be surprised if those players get the franchise tag.

extension :
samuel, bosa (with injury settlement for both)

key FA to sign :
Tomlinson, DJ Jones

Some continuity would be helpful at the right price :
Tartt, Key, K williams, Greenlaw or al shaair

Sign hem for cheap only (highly valuable but injured too often)
Verett, Mostert

Draft : stay put as we need to reload for depth with rookies
OL, WR, LB, RB, TE, DL

FA from other teams :
an upgrade on OL that doenst cost too much
a cheap DL if we cannot sign one of ours

Wasnt sure what thread this should go in, but I picked this one LOL:

Originally posted by SteveWallacesHelmet:
Wasnt sure what thread this should go in, but I picked this one LOL:

The #49ers signed DL Kevin Givens, RB JaMycal Hasty, DL Maurice Hurst and OL Colton McKivitz to one-year extensions. The team also re-signed QB Nate Sudfeld.

— Matt Maiocco (@MaioccoNBCS) March 10, 2022

DJ is gone isn't he?

The Hurst and Sudfeld ones surprise me. I am ok with bringing Hurst back but please god don't have Sudfeld as Trey's backup. Also heard we tendered Jennings and Fowles. Jennings is a no-brainer but surprised by Fowles. Thought they would let Fowles walk.