QB Brock Purdy Thread

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by Furlow:
There is no right or wrong IF the result is positive. Just imagine that Purdy threw an INT on that pass to Aiyuk; do you think Kyle would say it was the "correct" read? Hell no. Kyle was very clear if you just listen and don't have a bias - the right read (for our conservative coach) was the checkdown because it was wide open, we had the lead, it would have moved the chains, it was safe.

Kyle is a conservative minded head coach, weird that you and a few others keep trying to make it sound like he wants to air it out down the field like the 90's Oilers.

Not being Mike Martz doesn't make him conservative. He does want to push the ball down the field in the pass game. What he doesn't want to do is have his QB throw down the field into coverage. I guarantee in film study when he sees what Brock sees instead of just quickly watching from the sideline he will be happy with the decision.

Just like in 2016, if you give him a QB he can trust he will tell him to let it rip.

Kyle's offenses are routinely in the top 5 in rush attempts per game/season. Even in 2016 with the Falcons (Ryan MVP) they were 12th. He wants to run the ball and play defense. That is the definition of "conservative" in football terms. How is this even a debate?

Again, He's happy with the decision because it worked. It's not what's in his "blood" as a coach. It just isn't and never will be. Luckily for us we have the perfect complement for Kyle, a QB with a gunslinger mentality. They are a perfect pair.

Edit: In 2016, the Falcons were 26th in pass attempts. Not exactly "letting it rip" lol.

Bingo. That's as conservative as you'll get in today's passing league.

I remember so many thinking we'd become this pass centric team once we got rid of Jimmy. Haha.

Nope.

Yeah no. Matt Ryan in 2016 had exactly THREE NFL QBs attempt more deep passes than him. Just because it's run heavy doesn't mean it's conservative. The runs set up deep passes. As shown in my previous post, which is what the Falcons did in 2016, and it's what we've done this year, and did with Trey, and did more with Nick, Brian and CJ, but didn't do nearly as much with Jimmy. Due to Jimmy.

And? Nobody is saying you can't be hyper efficient (like Brock) within the lowest passing attempts in a passing league. Which by virtue is a conservative offense.

We have the fewest passing attempts because the score of our games averages out to a just under a two touchdown win. In 2017, when we were losing a lot, we had the 2nd most pass attempts.

See post #36021. Overall as an OC and HC, Kyle has a losing record. So the theory that he's blowing everyone out and that's why he runs so much is false. In 2014 the Browns were 7-9. They ranked 6th in rushing attempts and 26th in passing attempts. In 2018 the Niners were 4-12. They ranked 11th in rushing attempts and 20th in passing attempts. So despite all of that losing, he was still committed to running the ball. Yes, OF COURSE when teams are losing they are going to throw more than run. Hell that's true even when teams are winning, as most teams pass the ball more than they run (even good teams). Very few teams/coaches are as skewed towards the run as Kyle is. I'm stressing the word skewed and emphasizing RELATIVE TO the rest of the league.

Kyle wants to run the football and is as committed to it as any coach in the league. Only Harbaugh in Baltimore is even close and they have Lamar who is an elite running QB. Again, this is not a knock on Kyle.

Are you really going to bring his record as an OC into this? Thats crazy. Kyle has a career record of 66-52 including playoffs where he is 6-3.

Well I was being told by multiple posters that play calling is not dictated by offensive philosophy, only by the score of the game. So yes his record (and scores of those games) is relevant if THAT is the point. Although the argument keeps changing so it might be time for me to check out for a bit.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by NCommand:
And? Nobody is saying you can't be hyper efficient (like Brock) within the lowest passing attempts in a passing league. Which by virtue is a conservative offense.

So if Kyle eliminated 10 runs for screens and swing passes suddenly the offense is more aggressive?

When he's top 5 in passing attempts he will be.

That said, "conservative" may not be a fair word. Kyle is aggressively conservative within the limited passing attempts he chooses to use.

He's about balance and efficiency and calculated shots.

There's nothing wrong with that but let's not act like this is some pass centric offense esp. by today's standards.

Good post. For some reason the troops are getting triggered by the word "conservative" as if it's an insult. We'll use a different word, geezus lol.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by Furlow:
There is no right or wrong IF the result is positive. Just imagine that Purdy threw an INT on that pass to Aiyuk; do you think Kyle would say it was the "correct" read? Hell no. Kyle was very clear if you just listen and don't have a bias - the right read (for our conservative coach) was the checkdown because it was wide open, we had the lead, it would have moved the chains, it was safe.

Kyle is a conservative minded head coach, weird that you and a few others keep trying to make it sound like he wants to air it out down the field like the 90's Oilers.

Not being Mike Martz doesn't make him conservative. He does want to push the ball down the field in the pass game. What he doesn't want to do is have his QB throw down the field into coverage. I guarantee in film study when he sees what Brock sees instead of just quickly watching from the sideline he will be happy with the decision.

Just like in 2016, if you give him a QB he can trust he will tell him to let it rip.

Kyle's offenses are routinely in the top 5 in rush attempts per game/season. Even in 2016 with the Falcons (Ryan MVP) they were 12th. He wants to run the ball and play defense. That is the definition of "conservative" in football terms. How is this even a debate?

Again, He's happy with the decision because it worked. It's not what's in his "blood" as a coach. It just isn't and never will be. Luckily for us we have the perfect complement for Kyle, a QB with a gunslinger mentality. They are a perfect pair.

Edit: In 2016, the Falcons were 26th in pass attempts. Not exactly "letting it rip" lol.

Bingo. That's as conservative as you'll get in today's passing league.

I remember so many thinking we'd become this pass centric team once we got rid of Jimmy. Haha.

Nope.

Yeah no. Matt Ryan in 2016 had exactly THREE NFL QBs attempt more deep passes than him. Just because it's run heavy doesn't mean it's conservative. The runs set up deep passes. As shown in my previous post, which is what the Falcons did in 2016, and it's what we've done this year, and did with Trey, and did more with Nick, Brian and CJ, but didn't do nearly as much with Jimmy. Due to Jimmy.

And? Nobody is saying you can't be hyper efficient (like Brock) within the lowest passing attempts in a passing league. Which by virtue is a conservative offense.

We have the fewest passing attempts because the score of our games averages out to a just under a two touchdown win. In 2017, when we were losing a lot, we had the 2nd most pass attempts.

His balance is the same in the end whether we're winning or losing (rush/pass ratio). This is his formula and I'm unsure why there still are a few who won't accept that. This is who he is...as a head coach.

You have moved the goal post. Run vs pass balance is NOT the indicator of conservative vs aggressive. The 1999 Rams were 19th in pass attempts. The 2000 Rams were 3rd. Both were EXTREMELY aggressive, maybe the most aggressive offense that has ever existed. AIR YARDS is how you determine how aggressive an offense is. The Greatest Show on Turf threw the ball DOWN THE FIELD. They were WAY more aggressive, than say, the 1981 and 1982 49ers. Yet the 1981 and 1982 49ers threw the ball 9th most and 1st most, respectively. Throwing isn't what's aggressive. Throwing DOWN THE FIELD is what's aggressive.

Kyle's aggressiveness is DIRECTLY—nay, almost EXACTLY—tied to his quarterback. When Jimmy was the QB, we didn't throw down the field. With Brock as the QB, we throw down the field. When Matt Ryan was his QB, he threw down the field.

But what the former Jimmysexuals keep missing is that when Jimmy was the QB, DEEP ROUTES WERE CONSTANTLY CALLED. They just weren't CHOSEN by the quarterback. To explain this, the former Jimmysexuals claimed Kyle told Jimmy not to throw to the open man down the field—an absolutely ridiculous proposition, which strangely STILL is claimed today every once in a while, even though Brock thoroughly disproved that nonsense.

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by Furlow:
There is no right or wrong IF the result is positive. Just imagine that Purdy threw an INT on that pass to Aiyuk; do you think Kyle would say it was the "correct" read? Hell no. Kyle was very clear if you just listen and don't have a bias - the right read (for our conservative coach) was the checkdown because it was wide open, we had the lead, it would have moved the chains, it was safe.

Kyle is a conservative minded head coach, weird that you and a few others keep trying to make it sound like he wants to air it out down the field like the 90's Oilers.

Not being Mike Martz doesn't make him conservative. He does want to push the ball down the field in the pass game. What he doesn't want to do is have his QB throw down the field into coverage. I guarantee in film study when he sees what Brock sees instead of just quickly watching from the sideline he will be happy with the decision.

Just like in 2016, if you give him a QB he can trust he will tell him to let it rip.

Kyle's offenses are routinely in the top 5 in rush attempts per game/season. Even in 2016 with the Falcons (Ryan MVP) they were 12th. He wants to run the ball and play defense. That is the definition of "conservative" in football terms. How is this even a debate?

Again, He's happy with the decision because it worked. It's not what's in his "blood" as a coach. It just isn't and never will be. Luckily for us we have the perfect complement for Kyle, a QB with a gunslinger mentality. They are a perfect pair.

Edit: In 2016, the Falcons were 26th in pass attempts. Not exactly "letting it rip" lol.

Bingo. That's as conservative as you'll get in today's passing league.

I remember so many thinking we'd become this pass centric team once we got rid of Jimmy. Haha.

Nope.

Yeah no. Matt Ryan in 2016 had exactly THREE NFL QBs attempt more deep passes than him. Just because it's run heavy doesn't mean it's conservative. The runs set up deep passes. As shown in my previous post, which is what the Falcons did in 2016, and it's what we've done this year, and did with Trey, and did more with Nick, Brian and CJ, but didn't do nearly as much with Jimmy. Due to Jimmy.

And? Nobody is saying you can't be hyper efficient (like Brock) within the lowest passing attempts in a passing league. Which by virtue is a conservative offense.

We have the fewest passing attempts because the score of our games averages out to a just under a two touchdown win. In 2017, when we were losing a lot, we had the 2nd most pass attempts.

See post #36021. Overall as an OC and HC, Kyle has a losing record. So the theory that he's blowing everyone out and that's why he runs so much is false. In 2014 the Browns were 7-9. They ranked 6th in rushing attempts and 26th in passing attempts. In 2018 the Niners were 4-12. They ranked 11th in rushing attempts and 20th in passing attempts. So despite all of that losing, he was still committed to running the ball. Yes, OF COURSE when teams are losing they are going to throw more than run. Hell that's true even when teams are winning, as most teams pass the ball more than they run (even good teams). Very few teams/coaches are as skewed towards the run as Kyle is. I'm stressing the word skewed and emphasizing RELATIVE TO the rest of the league.

Kyle wants to run the football and is as committed to it as any coach in the league. Only Harbaugh in Baltimore is even close and they have Lamar who is an elite running QB. Again, this is not a knock on Kyle.

Are you really going to bring his record as an OC into this? Thats crazy. Kyle has a career record of 66-52 including playoffs where he is 6-3.

Well I was being told by multiple posters that play calling is not dictated by offensive philosophy, only by the score of the game. So yes his record (and scores of those games) is relevant if THAT is the point. Although the argument keeps changing so it might be time for me to check out for a bit.

That's false. What was told to you was that the score has a major influence. Nevertheless, aggressiveness is about whether or not the passes are deep, not run-pass balance. The 1982 49ers led the NFL in pass attempts. The 1999 Rams were 19th. To claim that the 1982 49ers were more aggressive is so astoundingly stupid it's actually insulting.

So let's settle that one question now: which was the more aggressive offense, the 1982 49ers, who lead the NFL in pass attempts—but ran a slow, BALL CONTROL offense, or the 1999 Rams, who are considered among the most aggressive offenses in NFL history who ran an offense that constantly pushed the ball down the field when they threw?

Pretty simple question. Will he answer it?

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by Furlow:
There is no right or wrong IF the result is positive. Just imagine that Purdy threw an INT on that pass to Aiyuk; do you think Kyle would say it was the "correct" read? Hell no. Kyle was very clear if you just listen and don't have a bias - the right read (for our conservative coach) was the checkdown because it was wide open, we had the lead, it would have moved the chains, it was safe.

Kyle is a conservative minded head coach, weird that you and a few others keep trying to make it sound like he wants to air it out down the field like the 90's Oilers.

Not being Mike Martz doesn't make him conservative. He does want to push the ball down the field in the pass game. What he doesn't want to do is have his QB throw down the field into coverage. I guarantee in film study when he sees what Brock sees instead of just quickly watching from the sideline he will be happy with the decision.

Just like in 2016, if you give him a QB he can trust he will tell him to let it rip.

Kyle's offenses are routinely in the top 5 in rush attempts per game/season. Even in 2016 with the Falcons (Ryan MVP) they were 12th. He wants to run the ball and play defense. That is the definition of "conservative" in football terms. How is this even a debate?

Again, He's happy with the decision because it worked. It's not what's in his "blood" as a coach. It just isn't and never will be. Luckily for us we have the perfect complement for Kyle, a QB with a gunslinger mentality. They are a perfect pair.

Edit: In 2016, the Falcons were 26th in pass attempts. Not exactly "letting it rip" lol.

Bingo. That's as conservative as you'll get in today's passing league.

I remember so many thinking we'd become this pass centric team once we got rid of Jimmy. Haha.

Nope.

Yeah no. Matt Ryan in 2016 had exactly THREE NFL QBs attempt more deep passes than him. Just because it's run heavy doesn't mean it's conservative. The runs set up deep passes. As shown in my previous post, which is what the Falcons did in 2016, and it's what we've done this year, and did with Trey, and did more with Nick, Brian and CJ, but didn't do nearly as much with Jimmy. Due to Jimmy.

And? Nobody is saying you can't be hyper efficient (like Brock) within the lowest passing attempts in a passing league. Which by virtue is a conservative offense.

We have the fewest passing attempts because the score of our games averages out to a just under a two touchdown win. In 2017, when we were losing a lot, we had the 2nd most pass attempts.

His balance is the same in the end whether we're winning or losing (rush/pass ratio). This is his formula and I'm unsure why there still are a few who won't accept that. This is who he is...as a head coach.

You have moved the goal post. Run vs pass balance is NOT the indicator of conservative vs aggressive. The 1999 Rams were 19th in pass attempts. The 2000 Rams were 3rd. Both were EXTREMELY aggressive, maybe the most aggressive offense that has ever existed. AIR YARDS is how you determine how aggressive an offense is. The Greatest Show on Turf threw the ball DOWN THE FIELD. They were WAY more aggressive, than say, the 1981 and 1982 49ers. Yet the 1981 and 1982 49ers threw the ball 9th most and 1st most, respectively. Throwing isn't what's aggressive. Throwing DOWN THE FIELD is what's aggressive.

Kyle's aggressiveness is DIRECTLY—nay, almost EXACTLY—tied to his quarterback. When Jimmy was the QB, we didn't throw down the field. With Brock as the QB, we throw down the field. When Matt Ryan was his QB, he threw down the field.

But what the former Jimmysexuals keep missing is that when Jimmy was the QB, DEEP ROUTES WERE CONSTANTLY CALLED. They just weren't CHOSEN by the quarterback. To explain this, the former Jimmysexuals claimed Kyle told Jimmy not to throw to the open man down the field—an absolutely ridiculous proposition, which strangely STILL is claimed today every once in a while, even though Brock thoroughly disproved that nonsense.

See this is what I'm talking about. It's like you guys think that Kyle calls a play, and then wherever the ball is thrown is attributed to Kyle. Purdy is throwing deep successfully and Jimmy wasn't - "see, Kyle wants to throw deep." You sound like the pundits who give Purdy zero credit and dismiss him as a system QB.

Yet we have Kyle himself talking about holding his breath on a deep pass from Purdy, we have Aiyuk saying that before Purdy clear out routes meant you weren't getting the ball but now they're in play, etc. Plenty of breadcrumbs here to see between the lines and give credit to Purdy for expanding the offense beyond Kyle's design. But okay, it's ALL Kyle. He's playing Madden, and merely needs the physical attributes of the players on the team to be successful. The players aren't making decisions, just acting as Kyle's robots. That about sums up what you're all saying.

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by YACBros85:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by Furlow:
There is no right or wrong IF the result is positive. Just imagine that Purdy threw an INT on that pass to Aiyuk; do you think Kyle would say it was the "correct" read? Hell no. Kyle was very clear if you just listen and don't have a bias - the right read (for our conservative coach) was the checkdown because it was wide open, we had the lead, it would have moved the chains, it was safe.

Kyle is a conservative minded head coach, weird that you and a few others keep trying to make it sound like he wants to air it out down the field like the 90's Oilers.

Not being Mike Martz doesn't make him conservative. He does want to push the ball down the field in the pass game. What he doesn't want to do is have his QB throw down the field into coverage. I guarantee in film study when he sees what Brock sees instead of just quickly watching from the sideline he will be happy with the decision.

Just like in 2016, if you give him a QB he can trust he will tell him to let it rip.

Kyle's offenses are routinely in the top 5 in rush attempts per game/season. Even in 2016 with the Falcons (Ryan MVP) they were 12th. He wants to run the ball and play defense. That is the definition of "conservative" in football terms. How is this even a debate?

Again, He's happy with the decision because it worked. It's not what's in his "blood" as a coach. It just isn't and never will be. Luckily for us we have the perfect complement for Kyle, a QB with a gunslinger mentality. They are a perfect pair.

Edit: In 2016, the Falcons were 26th in pass attempts. Not exactly "letting it rip" lol.

Bingo. That's as conservative as you'll get in today's passing league.

I remember so many thinking we'd become this pass centric team once we got rid of Jimmy. Haha.

Nope.

Yeah no. Matt Ryan in 2016 had exactly THREE NFL QBs attempt more deep passes than him. Just because it's run heavy doesn't mean it's conservative. The runs set up deep passes. As shown in my previous post, which is what the Falcons did in 2016, and it's what we've done this year, and did with Trey, and did more with Nick, Brian and CJ, but didn't do nearly as much with Jimmy. Due to Jimmy.

And? Nobody is saying you can't be hyper efficient (like Brock) within the lowest passing attempts in a passing league. Which by virtue is a conservative offense.

We have the fewest passing attempts because the score of our games averages out to a just under a two touchdown win. In 2017, when we were losing a lot, we had the 2nd most pass attempts.

See post #36021. Overall as an OC and HC, Kyle has a losing record. So the theory that he's blowing everyone out and that's why he runs so much is false. In 2014 the Browns were 7-9. They ranked 6th in rushing attempts and 26th in passing attempts. In 2018 the Niners were 4-12. They ranked 11th in rushing attempts and 20th in passing attempts. So despite all of that losing, he was still committed to running the ball. Yes, OF COURSE when teams are losing they are going to throw more than run. Hell that's true even when teams are winning, as most teams pass the ball more than they run (even good teams). Very few teams/coaches are as skewed towards the run as Kyle is. I'm stressing the word skewed and emphasizing RELATIVE TO the rest of the league.

Kyle wants to run the football and is as committed to it as any coach in the league. Only Harbaugh in Baltimore is even close and they have Lamar who is an elite running QB. Again, this is not a knock on Kyle.

Are you really going to bring his record as an OC into this? Thats crazy. Kyle has a career record of 66-52 including playoffs where he is 6-3.

Well I was being told by multiple posters that play calling is not dictated by offensive philosophy, only by the score of the game. So yes his record (and scores of those games) is relevant if THAT is the point. Although the argument keeps changing so it might be time for me to check out for a bit.

That's false. What was told to you was that the score has a major influence. Nevertheless, aggressiveness is about whether or not the passes are deep, not run-pass balance. The 1982 49ers led the NFL in pass attempts. The 1999 Rams were 19th. To claim that the 1982 49ers were more aggressive is so astoundingly stupid it's actually insulting.

So let's settle that one question now: which was the more aggressive offense, the 1982 49ers, who lead the NFL in pass attempts—but ran a slow, BALL CONTROL offense, or the 1999 Rams, who are considered among the most aggressive offenses in NFL history who ran an offense that constantly pushed the ball down the field when they threw?

Pretty simple question. Will he answer it?

Probably one of the worst examples I've ever seen on the zone. The Niners in the early 80's with Walsh were completely reinventing the way the game was played. Relative to other teams in 1982, they were absolutely very aggressive. To compare them to a team 17 years in the future is so astoundingly stupid it's actually insulting.

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by NCommand:
And? Nobody is saying you can't be hyper efficient (like Brock) within the lowest passing attempts in a passing league. Which by virtue is a conservative offense.

So if Kyle eliminated 10 runs for screens and swing passes suddenly the offense is more aggressive?

For real. Why are we equating pass attempts to how aggressive an offense is? Such an odd correlation.

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by 5_Golden_Rings:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by Furlow:
There is no right or wrong IF the result is positive. Just imagine that Purdy threw an INT on that pass to Aiyuk; do you think Kyle would say it was the "correct" read? Hell no. Kyle was very clear if you just listen and don't have a bias - the right read (for our conservative coach) was the checkdown because it was wide open, we had the lead, it would have moved the chains, it was safe.

Kyle is a conservative minded head coach, weird that you and a few others keep trying to make it sound like he wants to air it out down the field like the 90's Oilers.

Not being Mike Martz doesn't make him conservative. He does want to push the ball down the field in the pass game. What he doesn't want to do is have his QB throw down the field into coverage. I guarantee in film study when he sees what Brock sees instead of just quickly watching from the sideline he will be happy with the decision.

Just like in 2016, if you give him a QB he can trust he will tell him to let it rip.

Kyle's offenses are routinely in the top 5 in rush attempts per game/season. Even in 2016 with the Falcons (Ryan MVP) they were 12th. He wants to run the ball and play defense. That is the definition of "conservative" in football terms. How is this even a debate?

Again, He's happy with the decision because it worked. It's not what's in his "blood" as a coach. It just isn't and never will be. Luckily for us we have the perfect complement for Kyle, a QB with a gunslinger mentality. They are a perfect pair.

Edit: In 2016, the Falcons were 26th in pass attempts. Not exactly "letting it rip" lol.

Bingo. That's as conservative as you'll get in today's passing league.

I remember so many thinking we'd become this pass centric team once we got rid of Jimmy. Haha.

Nope.

Yeah no. Matt Ryan in 2016 had exactly THREE NFL QBs attempt more deep passes than him. Just because it's run heavy doesn't mean it's conservative. The runs set up deep passes. As shown in my previous post, which is what the Falcons did in 2016, and it's what we've done this year, and did with Trey, and did more with Nick, Brian and CJ, but didn't do nearly as much with Jimmy. Due to Jimmy.

And? Nobody is saying you can't be hyper efficient (like Brock) within the lowest passing attempts in a passing league. Which by virtue is a conservative offense.

We have the fewest passing attempts because the score of our games averages out to a just under a two touchdown win. In 2017, when we were losing a lot, we had the 2nd most pass attempts.

His balance is the same in the end whether we're winning or losing (rush/pass ratio). This is his formula and I'm unsure why there still are a few who won't accept that. This is who he is...as a head coach.

You have moved the goal post. Run vs pass balance is NOT the indicator of conservative vs aggressive. The 1999 Rams were 19th in pass attempts. The 2000 Rams were 3rd. Both were EXTREMELY aggressive, maybe the most aggressive offense that has ever existed. AIR YARDS is how you determine how aggressive an offense is. The Greatest Show on Turf threw the ball DOWN THE FIELD. They were WAY more aggressive, than say, the 1981 and 1982 49ers. Yet the 1981 and 1982 49ers threw the ball 9th most and 1st most, respectively. Throwing isn't what's aggressive. Throwing DOWN THE FIELD is what's aggressive.

Kyle's aggressiveness is DIRECTLY—nay, almost EXACTLY—tied to his quarterback. When Jimmy was the QB, we didn't throw down the field. With Brock as the QB, we throw down the field. When Matt Ryan was his QB, he threw down the field.

But what the former Jimmysexuals keep missing is that when Jimmy was the QB, DEEP ROUTES WERE CONSTANTLY CALLED. They just weren't CHOSEN by the quarterback. To explain this, the former Jimmysexuals claimed Kyle told Jimmy not to throw to the open man down the field—an absolutely ridiculous proposition, which strangely STILL is claimed today every once in a while, even though Brock thoroughly disproved that nonsense.

See this is what I'm talking about. It's like you guys think that Kyle calls a play, and then wherever the ball is thrown is attributed to Kyle. Purdy is throwing deep successfully and Jimmy wasn't - "see, Kyle wants to throw deep." You sound like the pundits who give Purdy zero credit and dismiss him as a system QB.

Yet we have Kyle himself talking about holding his breath on a deep pass from Purdy, we have Aiyuk saying that before Purdy clear out routes meant you weren't getting the ball but now they're in play, etc. Plenty of breadcrumbs here to see between the lines and give credit to Purdy for expanding the offense beyond Kyle's design. But okay, it's ALL Kyle. He's playing Madden, and merely needs the physical attributes of the players on the team to be successful. The players aren't making decisions, just acting as Kyle's robots. That about sums up what you're all saying.

Obviously Brock Makes Kyle's offense run like a high octane machine. We've seen Kyle when he has a QB like Jimmy. He can make it run, sure. But without Brock we would still be running QB power.

An aggressive offense is one that tries to convert a 3rd & 12, and I don't mean throw a WR bubble screen hoping the defense misses a bunch of tackles. An aggressive offense goes for it on 4th and 5 at midfield. Goes for the touchdown on 3rd and goal from the 10 yard line, and not dial up a conservative play call and settle for a field goal. Look at critical game situations, and what that offense does to determine whether it's aggressive or conservative.

But if we want to look at stats, I do think that Average Depth of Target is meaningful to know how the QB is operating the passing attack. So what if a QB throws a bunch of passes that travel 6 yards downfield instead of running the ball - that's not an indicator of aggressiveness.

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by NCommand:
And? Nobody is saying you can't be hyper efficient (like Brock) within the lowest passing attempts in a passing league. Which by virtue is a conservative offense.

So if Kyle eliminated 10 runs for screens and swing passes suddenly the offense is more aggressive?

For real. Why are we equating pass attempts to how aggressive an offense is? Such an odd correlation.

Because in general, passing is more aggressive than running the football due to the higher probability for turnovers, negative yardage, etc.

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by NCommand:
And? Nobody is saying you can't be hyper efficient (like Brock) within the lowest passing attempts in a passing league. Which by virtue is a conservative offense.

So if Kyle eliminated 10 runs for screens and swing passes suddenly the offense is more aggressive?

For real. Why are we equating pass attempts to how aggressive an offense is? Such an odd correlation.

Because in general, passing is more aggressive than running the football due to the higher probability for turnovers, negative yardage, etc.

I'm looking at the total number of pass attempts for the current season and by your metric, the Commanders have the most aggressive offense in the league. That doesn't seem right to me.

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by NCommand:
And? Nobody is saying you can't be hyper efficient (like Brock) within the lowest passing attempts in a passing league. Which by virtue is a conservative offense.

So if Kyle eliminated 10 runs for screens and swing passes suddenly the offense is more aggressive?

For real. Why are we equating pass attempts to how aggressive an offense is? Such an odd correlation.

Because in general, passing is more aggressive than running the football due to the higher probability for turnovers, negative yardage, etc.

I'm looking at the total number of pass attempts for the current season and by your metric, the Commanders have the most aggressive offense in the league. That doesn't seem right to me.

Hence me saying "in general." Of course game situation plays into the run/pass splits, but it's not the only variable that determines those splits. Each coach/play caller has an identity and philosophy that they find ideal. And with over 15 years of play calling in the NFL, it's pretty clear that Kyle wants to run the ball and control the clock. Even our pace is slow as we only average 60.5 plays per game which is 25th in the NFL. That is also a measure of how conservative a coach is (in my opinion anyway).

Originally posted by Furlow:
See this is what I'm talking about. It's like you guys think that Kyle calls a play, and then wherever the ball is thrown is attributed to Kyle. Purdy is throwing deep successfully and Jimmy wasn't - "see, Kyle wants to throw deep." You sound like the pundits who give Purdy zero credit and dismiss him as a system QB.

Yet we have Kyle himself talking about holding his breath on a deep pass from Purdy, we have Aiyuk saying that before Purdy clear out routes meant you weren't getting the ball but now they're in play, etc. Plenty of breadcrumbs here to see between the lines and give credit to Purdy for expanding the offense beyond Kyle's design. But okay, it's ALL Kyle. He's playing Madden, and merely needs the physical attributes of the players on the team to be successful. The players aren't making decisions, just acting as Kyle's robots. That about sums up what you're all saying.

I just don't think this argument actually makes that much sense. Kyle's offense is going to give a QB multiple options on almost every passing play just like every other passing offense in the league. Whether one decision is safer, or better, and the coach see's it differently than the QB, that doesn't mean the QB is making his decision out of structure.

There are many different ways that QB's play out of structure, positive and negative. The elements that Brock brings that we are mostly attributing as positives are his ability to extend plays and find open receivers or gain yardage on the ground in what are effectively scramble drills. More aggressive passing and decision making doesn't necessarily qualify.

As far as whether Kyle is conservative or not, to me this is at least partially a semantics argument. He's conservative in some ways, and he's aggressive in others. An easy example for me is I think he's aggressive in play selection in the pass game, and I think he's conservative in terms of clock management overall.

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by NCommand:
And? Nobody is saying you can't be hyper efficient (like Brock) within the lowest passing attempts in a passing league. Which by virtue is a conservative offense.

So if Kyle eliminated 10 runs for screens and swing passes suddenly the offense is more aggressive?

For real. Why are we equating pass attempts to how aggressive an offense is? Such an odd correlation.

Because in general, passing is more aggressive than running the football due to the higher probability for turnovers, negative yardage, etc.

I'm looking at the total number of pass attempts for the current season and by your metric, the Commanders have the most aggressive offense in the league. That doesn't seem right to me.

If you watch Howell play he's a bit of a mad lad. Lot of drop backs, lot of sacks, ton of yds and counting stats, I think he led NFL in passing yds entering last week
I'd say they are up there, they are a fun watch imo, you see the good, the bad and the ugly lol it's all there. Highly entertaining just imo, I did miss that holiday game tho, and I see it didn't go well

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by thl408:

Originally posted by 9ers4eva:

Originally posted by NCommand:
And? Nobody is saying you can't be hyper efficient (like Brock) within the lowest passing attempts in a passing league. Which by virtue is a conservative offense.

So if Kyle eliminated 10 runs for screens and swing passes suddenly the offense is more aggressive?

For real. Why are we equating pass attempts to how aggressive an offense is? Such an odd correlation.

Because in general, passing is more aggressive than running the football due to the higher probability for turnovers, negative yardage, etc.

I'm looking at the total number of pass attempts for the current season and by your metric, the Commanders have the most aggressive offense in the league. That doesn't seem right to me.

So I guess the Ravens are the most conservative and the eagles are more conservative than us