QB Brock Purdy Thread

Originally posted by Jeepzilla:

Originally posted by random49er:

Originally posted by Typecast:

Originally posted by random49er:

Originally posted by Typecast:
Phase 1 of the offseason activities start on April 21st. Phase 3 (OTAs) start on May 27th. If we hit OTAs and a deal is not done, then start to worry.
Aiyuk didn't get ghosted by Paraag until mid-May last offseason.

Why worry when he is under contract?

Good god you are annoying. The concern is that you have ownership, Lynch, Shanahan, and Purdy wanting a deal done before OTAs. They want to get the extension done and that's the deadline they've set.

They didnt set any deadline. You're making stuff up. Lynch himself said he's making "no guarantees" or promises it will get done by then.

I'm annoying because I'm not allowing you to make stuff up out of thin air. I know.

The onus is on Purdy. He's under contract and he cannot accrue a year if he holds out for too long.

I know you may not like the truth, but it is what it is...

"The onus is on Purdy. He's under contract and he cannot accrue a year if he holds out for too long."

omg dude.. didn't you just argue for pages with typecast that can't be done after he showed you it can!

lmao
so clueless

I did not claim anything about accruing a season. I answered his question about where another poster got the idea that 6 games played was a requirement to accrue a season. Spoiler: The CBA.

Originally posted by dj43:
Enough with ridiculous ideas about Purdy - trading him for TJ Watt?

Watt would be great but who plays QB for SF?

roflmfao, that ESPN segment was awful. As someone who hasn't regularly watched ESPN in years, the only person I recognize is Woody. edit - Starts at 3:25

Originally posted by Typecast:
Alex Smith for Andy Reid was a pretty great starter. If that was the Alex that turned out in Washington, sure. But that didn't happen. Alex was not good before the injury in Washington.

Of the 34 QBs that had 126 pass attempts (14 atts x 9 gms), 2018 Alex was 22nd in cmp% (27th in cmp% over expected), 23rd in pass yards, 31st in y/c, 29th in y/a, 21st in adj y/a, 25th in y/g, 26th in pass TDs, 5th in Ints, 22nd in QB Rating, 24th in QBR, 22nd in epa/play, 26th in win probability added per play, 21st in passing success rate. Besides Ints, those are huge drop-offs from both 2017 Alex and 2017 Kirk.

32 QB's with 224 Min Pass Attempts in 2017:

• 2017 Alex was 3rd in cmp% (3rd in cmp% over expected), 8th in pass yards, 9th in y/c, 2nd in y/a, 1st in adj y/a, 8th in y/g, 9th in pass TDs, 6th in pass TD%, 1st in Ints, 1st in Int%, 1st in QB Rating, 8th in QBR, 6th in epa/play, 6th in win probability added per play, 11th in pass success rate
• 2017 Kirk was 9th in cmp% (12th in cmp% over expected), 7th in pass yards, 11th in y/c, 9th in y/a, 11th in adj y/a, 10th in y/g, 8th in pass TDs, 24th in Ints, 12th in QB Rating, 17th in QBR, 16th in EPA/play, 10th in win probability added per play, 11th in pass success rate

He really benefited from his defense beating up on terrible opponents. They had the 10th easiest strength of schedule played through 10 weeks, facing only three teams that ended the season with winning records. Two of those team blew Washington out by double digits. They squeaked out a 3-pt win against the Cowboys. That defense gave up 15.7ppg against the bad teams with the offense putting up 21.3ppg.

You don't have to convince me that Kirk Cousins was a better player than Alex Smith, lol. And of course he didn't have the production he had in KC, in a new offense with worse coaching and worse players around him. He played 9 games and suffered a career ending injury effectively. He was an average starter at his peak.

You could try to argue that Washington should have kept Cousins, because that would be to the point. That it was somehow a significant setback for them to move on. Cousins isn't a QB worth paying at the top of the market simply because 'that's what teams do with QBs' You could note that Genus makes the point that sometimes these deals happen because coaches protect their jobs!

You could also look at what happened in Minnesota where Kirk was largely successful and was adequately replaced by a bridge starter in Darnold. Is he better than Darnold? Without question… is he the difference in that team competing for a SB vs getting knocked out in the 1st or 2nd round? Probably not.

Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:
You don't have to convince me that Kirk Cousins was a better player than Alex Smith, lol. And of course he didn't have the production he had in KC, in a new offense with worse coaching and worse players around him. He played 9 games and suffered a career ending injury effectively. He was an average starter at his peak.

You could try to argue that Washington should have kept Cousins, because that would be to the point. That it was somehow a significant setback for them to move on. Cousins isn't a QB worth paying at the top of the market simply because 'that's what teams do with QBs' You could note that Genus makes the point that sometimes these deals happen because coaches protect their jobs!

You could also look at what happened in Minnesota where Kirk was largely successful and was adequately replaced by a bridge starter in Darnold. Is he better than Darnold? Without question… is he the difference in that team competing for a SB vs getting knocked out in the 1st or 2nd round? Probably not.

Honestly we're just spinning our wheels in here until the deal is done or the season starts so we have something else to talk about.

However there are levels to these things. Where fans stand on the contract stuff clearly goes off how those fans feel about Brock as a player.

One thing that isn't an opinion is that Brock has more success in the playoffs than all of the following QBs

Tua
Dak
Jordan Love
Cousins
Lawrence

And while playoff games don't overrule everything else they're certainly pretty important in the goals of every franchise out there. If we're talking about QBs who can help you win the SB their play in the postseason is pretty big in the evaluation process.

Brock had all sorts of crazy things happen this past season and while the record wasn't great and the TDs were down and turnovers were up overall the offense wasn't the major issue. He was still top 10 in many metrics and stats despite the issues around him.

I believe with all that data his people are certainly within real reason to push to mimic most of those contracts - minus Dak who wasn't going into his 2nd contract and had the Cowboys over the barrel with the way they operate their offense.

Brock has shown a lot more that Kirk Cousins had at this point in his career and the playoff performance tops Kirk even as a seasoned vet with many more years to move that needle for Kirk. Letting Brock walk just doesn't make sense. They have no better option and even if they wanted to roll the dice on another QB on a rookie deal this is not the draft to make that move imo.

I think if people are being rational there is no real smart reason why this deal doesn't get done from both sides. The only people who think it's smart to let Brock play this out are fans who have nothing on the line but fear that Brock isn't the guy and 49ers may regret paying him. That's it.

Originally posted by genus49:
Honestly we're just spinning our wheels in here until the deal is done or the season starts so we have something else to talk about.

However there are levels to these things. Where fans stand on the contract stuff clearly goes off how those fans feel about Brock as a player.

One thing that isn't an opinion is that Brock has more success in the playoffs than all of the following QBs

Tua
Dak
Jordan Love
Cousins
Lawrence

And while playoff games don't overrule everything else they're certainly pretty important in the goals of every franchise out there. If we're talking about QBs who can help you win the SB their play in the postseason is pretty big in the evaluation process.

Brock had all sorts of crazy things happen this past season and while the record wasn't great and the TDs were down and turnovers were up overall the offense wasn't the major issue. He was still top 10 in many metrics and stats despite the issues around him.

I believe with all that data his people are certainly within real reason to push to mimic most of those contracts - minus Dak who wasn't going into his 2nd contract and had the Cowboys over the barrel with the way they operate their offense.

Brock has shown a lot more that Kirk Cousins had at this point in his career and the playoff performance tops Kirk even as a seasoned vet with many more years to move that needle for Kirk. Letting Brock walk just doesn't make sense. They have no better option and even if they wanted to roll the dice on another QB on a rookie deal this is not the draft to make that move imo.

I think if people are being rational there is no real smart reason why this deal doesn't get done from both sides. The only people who think it's smart to let Brock play this out are fans who have nothing on the line but fear that Brock isn't the guy and 49ers may regret paying him. That's it.

Any one of those QBs would have had success with the All Star team Brock had in 2023.

Originally posted by Sask49erFan:

Originally posted by genus49:
Honestly we're just spinning our wheels in here until the deal is done or the season starts so we have something else to talk about.

However there are levels to these things. Where fans stand on the contract stuff clearly goes off how those fans feel about Brock as a player.

One thing that isn't an opinion is that Brock has more success in the playoffs than all of the following QBs

Tua
Dak
Jordan Love
Cousins
Lawrence

And while playoff games don't overrule everything else they're certainly pretty important in the goals of every franchise out there. If we're talking about QBs who can help you win the SB their play in the postseason is pretty big in the evaluation process.

Brock had all sorts of crazy things happen this past season and while the record wasn't great and the TDs were down and turnovers were up overall the offense wasn't the major issue. He was still top 10 in many metrics and stats despite the issues around him.

I believe with all that data his people are certainly within real reason to push to mimic most of those contracts - minus Dak who wasn't going into his 2nd contract and had the Cowboys over the barrel with the way they operate their offense.

Brock has shown a lot more that Kirk Cousins had at this point in his career and the playoff performance tops Kirk even as a seasoned vet with many more years to move that needle for Kirk. Letting Brock walk just doesn't make sense. They have no better option and even if they wanted to roll the dice on another QB on a rookie deal this is not the draft to make that move imo.

I think if people are being rational there is no real smart reason why this deal doesn't get done from both sides. The only people who think it's smart to let Brock play this out are fans who have nothing on the line but fear that Brock isn't the guy and 49ers may regret paying him. That's it.

Any one of those QBs would have had success with the All Star team Brock had in 2023.

Ahh yes the wonderful hypothetical that cannot be proven.

Funny enough I realized most of those QBs made the playoffs in 2023, so reminder of where Brock's All Star team ranked as far as pass pro compared to those other QBs.

Originally posted by Jeepzilla:
"The onus is on Purdy. He's under contract and he cannot accrue a year if he holds out for too long."

omg dude.. didn't you just argue for pages with typecast that can't be done after he showed you it can!

lmao
so clueless

No,...lol. You're completely lost. Reread.

Originally posted by genus49:
Honestly we're just spinning our wheels in here until the deal is done or the season starts so we have something else to talk about.

However there are levels to these things. Where fans stand on the contract stuff clearly goes off how those fans feel about Brock as a player.

One thing that isn't an opinion is that Brock has more success in the playoffs than all of the following QBs

Tua
Dak
Jordan Love
Cousins
Lawrence

And while playoff games don't overrule everything else they're certainly pretty important in the goals of every franchise out there. If we're talking about QBs who can help you win the SB their play in the postseason is pretty big in the evaluation process.

Brock had all sorts of crazy things happen this past season and while the record wasn't great and the TDs were down and turnovers were up overall the offense wasn't the major issue. He was still top 10 in many metrics and stats despite the issues around him.

I believe with all that data his people are certainly within real reason to push to mimic most of those contracts - minus Dak who wasn't going into his 2nd contract and had the Cowboys over the barrel with the way they operate their offense.

Brock has shown a lot more that Kirk Cousins had at this point in his career and the playoff performance tops Kirk even as a seasoned vet with many more years to move that needle for Kirk. Letting Brock walk just doesn't make sense. They have no better option and even if they wanted to roll the dice on another QB on a rookie deal this is not the draft to make that move imo.

I think if people are being rational there is no real smart reason why this deal doesn't get done from both sides. The only people who think it's smart to let Brock play this out are fans who have nothing on the line but fear that Brock isn't the guy and 49ers may regret paying him. That's it.

This would be an extreme opinion on the other side of the argument, and a nonsensical one at least right now because he's under contract. A person could advocate a trade of course, but us getting value greater than having Brock play out his deal as the starter ***at a minimum***, is unlikely. To me, it's not worthy of any real discussion.

Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:

Originally posted by genus49:
Honestly we're just spinning our wheels in here until the deal is done or the season starts so we have something else to talk about.

However there are levels to these things. Where fans stand on the contract stuff clearly goes off how those fans feel about Brock as a player.

One thing that isn't an opinion is that Brock has more success in the playoffs than all of the following QBs

Tua
Dak
Jordan Love
Cousins
Lawrence

And while playoff games don't overrule everything else they're certainly pretty important in the goals of every franchise out there. If we're talking about QBs who can help you win the SB their play in the postseason is pretty big in the evaluation process.

Brock had all sorts of crazy things happen this past season and while the record wasn't great and the TDs were down and turnovers were up overall the offense wasn't the major issue. He was still top 10 in many metrics and stats despite the issues around him.

I believe with all that data his people are certainly within real reason to push to mimic most of those contracts - minus Dak who wasn't going into his 2nd contract and had the Cowboys over the barrel with the way they operate their offense.

Brock has shown a lot more that Kirk Cousins had at this point in his career and the playoff performance tops Kirk even as a seasoned vet with many more years to move that needle for Kirk. Letting Brock walk just doesn't make sense. They have no better option and even if they wanted to roll the dice on another QB on a rookie deal this is not the draft to make that move imo.

I think if people are being rational there is no real smart reason why this deal doesn't get done from both sides. The only people who think it's smart to let Brock play this out are fans who have nothing on the line but fear that Brock isn't the guy and 49ers may regret paying him. That's it.

This would be an extreme opinion on the other side of the argument, and a nonsensical one at least right now because he's under contract. A person could advocate a trade of course, but us getting value greater than having Brock play out his deal as the starter ***at a minimum***, is unlikely. To me, it's not worthy of any real discussion.

I dont exactly see a success story in that list of QBs either. Why we gonna copy them? Because we made it to the SB in 2023 and they did not?

And as you said,...Brock can't walk anyway,...so what are we doing? That's adding to the list of hypotheticals perhaps years down the road.

Does nothing to convince an unconvinced reader from the obvious,...which is that Brock either A) Reduce his demands to very team-friendly cap hits, or B) prove himself in 2025 for his huge extension.

If his numbers swell, it'll be because they're convinced with the day-in, day-out player,....not because of the old, limited playoff results Brock's TEAM had.

Originally posted by SmokeyJoe:
This would be an extreme opinion on the other side of the argument, and a nonsensical one at least right now because he's under contract. A person could advocate a trade of course, but us getting value greater than having Brock play out his deal as the starter ***at a minimum***, is unlikely. To me, it's not worthy of any real discussion.

I should've phrased it better. But the folks pushing for the team to wait to see him play more before getting the deal done may as well be pushing for him to walk.

Cuz him walking after next year is really the only "upside" to not getting the deal done now.

Which is why I believe it makes sense for both sides to get the deal done now. No distractions for Brock, he can play free and the team doesn't need to delay only to likely pay more later on.

I think people are pushing for the team to wait to see him play more before swelling the numbers too much. I haven't seen people saying he shouldn't be offered anything, or we should let him walk without a tag or 2. We can better assess that when those times come, which is the benefit.

It does make sense for both sides to get a contract done now. The numbers have to be right for both parties, however. That's the one caveat that somehow gets left out.

Originally posted by random49er:
I dont exactly see a success story in that list of QBs either. Why we gonna copy them? Because we made it to the SB in 2023 and they did not?

And as you said,...Brock can't walk anyway,...so what are we doing? That's adding to the list of hypotheticals perhaps years down the road.

Does nothing to convince an unconvinced reader from the obvious,...which is that Brock either A) Reduce his demands to very team-friendly cap hits, or B) prove himself in 2025 for his huge extension.

If his numbers swell, it'll be because they're convinced with the day-in, day-out player,....not because of the old, limited playoff results Brock's TEAM had.

Crazy thought but…maybe cuz the team believes Brock is a better QB than those guys?

As I said in the past and above pushing the contract stuff to next year doesn't make a lot of sense. The only upside is if he sucks and you didn't end up paying him.

The downside is you're paying him more and you possibly impacted how good he could be this year cuz he may avoid some team workouts he'd participate in with the contract completed.

You keep claiming other teams made mistakes in their deals, they may not agree with your take.

Originally posted by random49er:
I dont exactly see a success story in that list of QBs either. Why we gonna copy them? Because we made it to the SB in 2023 and they did not?

And as you said,...Brock can't walk anyway,...so what are we doing? That's adding to the list of hypotheticals perhaps years down the road.

Does nothing to convince an unconvinced reader from the obvious,...which is that Brock either A) Reduce his demands to very team-friendly cap hits, or B) prove himself in 2025 for his huge extension.

If his numbers swell, it'll be because they're convinced with the day-in, day-out player,....not because of the old, limited playoff results Brock's TEAM had.

Maybe he won't have to depending on what the team offers etc. I would hope they play hardball though, within reason, and I expect they will. I also expect Brock will sign because ultimately it's in is his best interest and the team has the leverage. Sign him for as little as possible with as much protection as possible.

Originally posted by genus49:
Crazy thought but…maybe cuz the team believes Brock is a better QB than those guys?

As I said in the past and above pushing the contract stuff to next year doesn't make a lot of sense. The only upside is if he sucks and you didn't end up paying him.

The downside is you're paying him more and you possibly impacted how good he could be this year cuz he may avoid some team workouts he'd participate in with the contract completed.

You keep claiming other teams made mistakes in their deals, they may not agree with your take.

Give up leverage in negotiations because of belief that he is better, and should be paid more than them, irrespective of where they are with their cap and the rest of their team's contracts?

Alot more goes into this than "pay him because some other guys are making more."

e.g. We keep seeing Dak,...but Dak had a "no-tag" clause that prevented him from being tagged a 3rd time by the Cowboys if his contract had expired this offseason. They were pressed because they could not tag him. We are not.

They are going to want to meet in the middle,....not browse around at what other teams are messing up with, then decide the 49ers' fate.

Originally posted by random49er:
Give up leverage in negotiations because of belief that he is better, and should be paid more than them, irrespective of where they are with their cap and the rest of their team's contracts?

Alot more goes into this than "pay him because some other guys are making more."

e.g. We keep seeing Dak,...but Dak had a "no-tag" clause that prevented him from being tagged a 3rd time by the Cowboys if his contract had expired this offseason. They were pressed because they could not tag him. We are not.

They are going to want to meet in the middle,....not browse around at what other teams are messing up with, then decide the 49ers' fate.

This has literally been my point for months now while you've been talking franchise tag and mistakes other teams made and now you're turning around and saying the same thing?