Who holds this offense back more?

Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Completely agree with Steve Young.

"It goes back to the conversation we've had [about the trust in Jimmy Garoppolo]," Young said on the Tolbert & Copes show. "... because I can guarantee you that Kyle would love to throw for 500 yards a game. He's like his dad, I'm telling you. ... It's really just how they manage each other and how they create the space for each other. The management is full-speed ahead. They're managing each other, and that's how it is, and that's fruitful, and it's fine.

"The idea, philosophically, that Kyle wants to run the ball is not true, and people need to leave that behind," Young added.

This offense is the way it is because of Jimmy. Look at all the same or similar offenses run elsewhere and the difference is QB. Rodgers, Tua, etc.

Jimmy isn't a consistent downfield passer. We seldom see him dropping dimes regularly deep down the sideline. Shoot, I can't even remember the last time I've seen a fade pass in the red zone either. There's simply things that Kyle doesn't call because Jimmy doesn't excel at them. I think he had his chances earlier in his time here, and Kyle got tired of him screwing it up, so this is why you see what you see now (at least in my opinion).

I mean look @ how much we celebrate a pinpoint pass on his roll out this last week,....lol. It's because we're just not used to seeing it from him.

A # of other teams, they say good throw and move forward while we highlight it like it's the most amazing thing. We're engrained to expect less,...amazing talent on deck or not.

Taylor swift, she even said so herself.

Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Completely agree with Steve Young.

"It goes back to the conversation we've had [about the trust in Jimmy Garoppolo]," Young said on the Tolbert & Copes show. "... because I can guarantee you that Kyle would love to throw for 500 yards a game. He's like his dad, I'm telling you. ... It's really just how they manage each other and how they create the space for each other. The management is full-speed ahead. They're managing each other, and that's how it is, and that's fruitful, and it's fine.

"The idea, philosophically, that Kyle wants to run the ball is not true, and people need to leave that behind," Young added.

This offense is the way it is because of Jimmy. Look at all the same or similar offenses run elsewhere and the difference is QB. Rodgers, Tua, etc.

Jimmy isn't a consistent downfield passer. We seldom see him dropping dimes regularly deep down the sideline. Shoot, I can't even remember the last time I've seen a fade pass in the red zone either. There's simply things that Kyle doesn't call because Jimmy doesn't excel at them. I think he had his chances earlier in his time here, and Kyle got tired of him screwing it up, so this is why you see what you see now (at least in my opinion).

Originally posted by GetSomeRouteRunners:
What did Jimmy screw up?

He came in and killed it with a team that was heading towards the #1 overall pick for the 2nd consecutive year in 2017. That team had lost 24 of its last 26 games. He went 5-0. Averaged 8.8 yards per pass attempt. The team averaged 28.8 points per game in his 5 starts. In a stripped down version of Kyle's offense. That last part might be a hint.

Blows out his ACL week 3 of 2018.

Returns in 2019, team scores 479 points/30 points per game (2nd in the NFL), Jimmy finishes 3rd in yards per pass attempt, 8th in passer rating. Team would've won the SB if not for the refs blatantly rigging it for the "Face of the NFL."

Comes back in 2020, injures his ankle week 2, struggles with an injury he should not have been playing with...and now the team's trading 3 first round picks despite not even knowing what QB they're going to pick at #3.

And remember, the receivers Kyle chose were Pierre Garcon, Dante Pettis, Trent Taylor, Deebo Samuel, Jalen Hurd, and Brandon Aiyuk. Does that sound like a guy who wants to regularly throw "deep down the sideline" to you?

All of those guys were picked in 2019 in prior. At no point when he got any of those guys had he had Jimmy for more than 8 starts.

As you put it in your reintroduction here,..."I guess Steve Young just doesn't know football."

Originally posted by ChillninDaBay:

AKA Jimmy is not elite and is limited AF and not a probowl QB, that's why no one wanted to trade for him and he came back and became Trey's backup.

So who's holding who back again?... give me a break 🤣

Bingo. Do we need to be reminded of Jimmy's playoff passing stats? They're absolutely horrific. Whether it was last year or 2019, Jimmy was carried when it was playoff time.

At the end of the day, I don't want it to be perceived as being a Jimmy basher. He's a solid QB, he's simply not elite in any area outside of his release. If he was, we wouldn't be trying to replace him. IMO, the decision makers have spoken pretty loudly as far as the OP's question. We've seen what Kyle can do with a better QB. Why is it so hard to admit that the difference between the performance of his prior Atlanta offense and the one we have now, comes down to the caliber of QB running it?

Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Bingo. Do we need to be reminded of Jimmy's playoff passing stats? They're absolutely horrific. Whether it was last year or 2019, Jimmy was carried when it was playoff time.

At the end of the day, I don't want it to be perceived as being a Jimmy basher. He's a solid QB, he's simply not elite in any area outside of his release. If he was, we wouldn't be trying to replace him. IMO, the decision makers have spoken pretty loudly as far as the OP's question. We've seen what Kyle can do with a better QB. Why is it so hard to admit that the difference between the performance of his prior Atlanta offense and the one we have now, comes down to the caliber of QB running it?

If you are talking about the entire Kyle ERA I would agree with you. This year, I would disagree with you. Jimmy is playing a helluva lot better than playoff Jimmy. At least to this point.

Originally posted by random49er:
I mean look @ how much we celebrate a pinpoint pass on his roll out this last week,....lol. It's because we're just not used to seeing it from him.

A # of other teams, they say good throw and move forward while we highlight it like it's the most amazing thing. We're engrained to expect less,...amazing talent on deck or not.

Couldn't agree more; this is spot on. A "great game" from Jimmy in a game he threw for less then 250 yards and no TDs says a lot regarding your point. Before I get trashed; yes he should've had one TD pass and that 100% is on Aiyuk. He just needs to not turn it over and we win the game for the heaps of praise to come. That said; I wouldn't complain about that ever cause that's all we need him to do….for now.

Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Bingo. Do we need to be reminded of Jimmy's playoff passing stats? They're absolutely horrific. Whether it was last year or 2019, Jimmy was carried when it was playoff time.

At the end of the day, I don't want it to be perceived as being a Jimmy basher. He's a solid QB, he's simply not elite in any area outside of his release. If he was, we wouldn't be trying to replace him. IMO, the decision makers have spoken pretty loudly as far as the OP's question. We've seen what Kyle can do with a better QB. Why is it so hard to admit that the difference between the performance of his prior Atlanta offense and the one we have now, comes down to the caliber of QB running it?

And in before the NC excuse of the reason being Kyle was a YOLO OC then and HC now

Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Bingo. Do we need to be reminded of Jimmy's playoff passing stats? They're absolutely horrific. Whether it was last year or 2019, Jimmy was carried when it was playoff time.

At the end of the day, I don't want it to be perceived as being a Jimmy basher. He's a solid QB, he's simply not elite in any area outside of his release. If he was, we wouldn't be trying to replace him. IMO, the decision makers have spoken pretty loudly as far as the OP's question. We've seen what Kyle can do with a better QB. Why is it so hard to admit that the difference between the performance of his prior Atlanta offense and the one we have now, comes down to the caliber of QB running it?

Or likewise that the offense being run in Miami is more successful because of the QB running it down there.

Nothing you said should be construed as hating.

The entire poll boils down to

KS the coach
KS the GM

who is to blame?

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
The entire poll boils down to

KS the coach
KS the GM

who is to blame?

The GM obviously. Yet they've hit enough to still be pretty damn good.

Originally posted by 49ers808:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Bingo. Do we need to be reminded of Jimmy's playoff passing stats? They're absolutely horrific. Whether it was last year or 2019, Jimmy was carried when it was playoff time.

At the end of the day, I don't want it to be perceived as being a Jimmy basher. He's a solid QB, he's simply not elite in any area outside of his release. If he was, we wouldn't be trying to replace him. IMO, the decision makers have spoken pretty loudly as far as the OP's question. We've seen what Kyle can do with a better QB. Why is it so hard to admit that the difference between the performance of his prior Atlanta offense and the one we have now, comes down to the caliber of QB running it?

And in before the NC excuse of the reason being Kyle was a YOLO OC then and HC now

Everyone's entitled to their opinion. I just feel like this is something where connecting the dots is pretty easy. Steve-o sees it, I see it, many others here see, and I think the entire coaching staff and FO saw it over the past few years. We were EXTREMELY fortunate to even make the post-season last year after Jimmy had several outings where he was a big part of choking the game away. I give him credit for the good thing's he does do, but can't give a free pass on the bad.

I don´t like Jimmy and I don´t think we can win the ring with him and I can´t wait to see what Trey can do.

But but but THIS SEASON the one holding the offense back is Kyle.

Jimmy is playing the best footbal of his career and even he has thrown some nice deep passes from time to time and he is throwing outside the numbers for the first time of his career and he is improvising a little bit but Kyle still doesn´t want to open up his playbook because he is too affraid of the QB that HE WANTED to be here after all the drama this off-season because let´s be honest, if Jimmy is still here is because Kyle wants and that´s the thing I don´t understand about Kyle because he doesn´t want to get rid of him but he doesn´t trust him. Heck he didn´t want Brady in 2020 because he wanted to keep Jimmy only to show in his gameplans that he doesn´t trust him.

We all know that Andy Reid would get way more from this offense than Kyle on a regular basis and don´t tell me about Mahomes because Tagovailoa is the hawaiian Jimmy and McDaniel is showing confidence in him since game 1 and I´m pretty sure that McDaniel would be calling those same deep shots with Jimmy.

So yes, THIS SEASON Kyle is the one holding the offense back.

Originally posted by krizay:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Bingo. Do we need to be reminded of Jimmy's playoff passing stats? They're absolutely horrific. Whether it was last year or 2019, Jimmy was carried when it was playoff time.

At the end of the day, I don't want it to be perceived as being a Jimmy basher. He's a solid QB, he's simply not elite in any area outside of his release. If he was, we wouldn't be trying to replace him. IMO, the decision makers have spoken pretty loudly as far as the OP's question. We've seen what Kyle can do with a better QB. Why is it so hard to admit that the difference between the performance of his prior Atlanta offense and the one we have now, comes down to the caliber of QB running it?

If you are talking about the entire Kyle ERA I would agree with you. This year, I would disagree with you. Jimmy is playing a helluva lot better than playoff Jimmy. At least to this point.

First off, Jimmy always plays better in the regular season than playoffs. There's just something about that tougher competition that gets him. Meanwhile, Kyle has been able to salvage a winning playoff record DESPITE the stinkers that Jimmy has given us. And Jimmy should play better this year. He has All Pros at every level of the offense.

The only person who truly knows how much Jimmy handicaps this team is Kyle, since he has to design plays and game plans to mask the inadequacies. Everyone is still pulling for Jimmy to succeed, though. It's just like any other year that a starter gets injured and a backup has to play. We'll see if he can play himself into a starting gig next year or not, but I expect a sharp decline in play once Kyle isn't around to hold his hand.

Originally posted by Monsterniner:
I don´t like Jimmy and I don´t think we can win the ring with him and I can´t wait to see what Trey can do.

But but but THIS SEASON the one holding the offense back is Kyle.

Jimmy is playing the best footbal of his career and even he has thrown some nice deep passes from time to time and he is throwing outside the numbers for the first time of his career and he is improvising a little bit but Kyle still doesn´t want to open up his playbook because he is too affraid of the QB that HE WANTED to be here after all the drama this off-season because let´s be honest, if Jimmy is still here is because Kyle wants and that´s the thing I don´t understand about Kyle because he doesn´t want to get rid of him but he doesn´t trust him. Heck he didn´t want Brady in 2020 because he wanted to keep Jimmy only to show in his gameplans that he doesn´t trust him.

We all know that Andy Reid would get way more from this offense than Kyle on a regular basis and don´t tell me about Mahomes because Tagovailoa is the hawaiian Jimmy and McDaniel is showing confidence in him since game 1 and I´m pretty sure that McDaniel would be calling those same deep shots with Jimmy.

So yes, THIS SEASON Kyle is the one holding the offense back.

That's a negative, since jimmy arrived he has full access to every option on the field. He's his only reason for holding himself back. He finally starting to get comfortable or somewhat comfortable going into 2nd or more progressions

if you want to bring up Reid, look at the Reid Alex smith era and how lame that offense was. In now way is it the same as it is today

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:
The entire poll boils down to

KS the coach
KS the GM

who is to blame?

Who is to blame for what? It's almost as though the harder you think about something, the more absurd your posts become. Even as good as KS is, he can't make a backup QB perform like a great QB. He made huge moves to get a real QB, but he was injured. So Kyle is slathering as much lipstick on that pig as he can, and doing everything that can be done to win with the guy, until we can move on once our starting QB is healthy.