Are Wins a QB stat?

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by GoreGoreGore:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by DonnieDarko:
Marino was awesome, his teams weren't

end of story

can lock thread now

DM SB record 0-1, He's def not successful

He ranks top 10 in QB wins and his percentage is better than Brees. Even looking only at wins.. which I don't recommend.. he's still highly successful.

like i said calling Jimmy successful is an opinion

Jimmy LIVES in your dome lol. He was talking about Dan Marino.

This isn't about Jimmy. I made that point to show that stats collectively tell the story, not by themselves individually. Jimmy being the 6th highest rated passer of all-time does not mean he's the 6th best or even close. Nor does wins. But W/L is still a QB stat no matter how you slice it. Per NFL.com too.

where on NFL.com ?

Page 302
https://operations.nfl.com/media/6101/2022-record-and-fact-book.pdf

This is https://www.nfl.com/

not some fun facts and learn about football, you should print that out and grab some crayons lol

It's the official NFL record book. I don't see QBR though. Weird.

Thats bc it's an ESPN stat lol.

So again, only stats that the NFL recognizes are real stats?

Why would someone else's stats be official NFL stats?

Heck , Jed has a win/loss record if you can find the right site

Stay on topic (for once). The discussion is whether QB W/L record is a QB stat. Various standards are being thrown out but the one I keep hearing is whether the NFL recognizes it. In the case of QB W/L records, the NFL does recognize it. So that should be the end of the discussion, right?

I actually don't necessarily agree with that, and think that stats like QBR, air yards, etc. are indeed "stats" even though the NFL doesn't recognize them. Again, no singular stat is the "be all end all" which is what it seems many are trying to argue here. They all can contribute to a discussion about a player.

As far as owners, what better way would you compare the success of owners to one another than by their W/L record, number of Super Bowls won, etc?

Stay on topic? You're the one stuck on QBR digression tactic this whole time and now you're at it again with this stats are not stats bs. I never said that.

Why would the nfl not add wins to their actual stats site if they they truly recognize it ? maybe they don't have someone who knows how to configure a website?

why make it downloadable and not just a regular site to view the entire info… because it's just fun kiddie stuff

Dude seriously? Go look how long that NFL record book is, it's like 900 pages. They can't fit that neatly on one page for each position. Terrible argument.

And YOU are the main person bringing up NFL com as the standard. Yet you cite QBR constantly when discussing QB play. That's hypocritical.
https://www.dictionary.com/browse/hypocritical

there you go lying and digressing again. i don't cite QBR for anything or do it constantly.. thats you keep bringing it up because you can't comprehend what i said.

So the perpetual growth on every player and new players stats won't be 900 pages long if you took all that info from the actual NFL.com stat site... I mean the same player and numbers are already on the NFL.com site?.. you think the NFL is unable to add a simple W/L record to the QB stats ? man you really don't know how sites and info work.

Do multiple people have access to your account? Only logical explanation I can think of for how often your argument changes and how different they are each time.

ah every time you lose, you start this crap.. lol

you really do have a comprehension issues.

Multiple people in this thread alone have commented how you constantly change your argument and avoid the topic. This time YOU created it and you still can't stay on it. YOU set the standard that NFL.com is where "real stats" are.

Is QBR not a stat, then? You have yet to answer.

You're also all over the place regarding the NFL record book. It's a coffee table book, a kid's book. Either the NFL is your standard or it isn't. You can't have it both ways.

would be really funny to see grown men arguing about this back and forth at a 49er tailgate before a game

Originally posted by Sanfran_chrisco:
would be really funny to see grown men arguing about this back and forth at a 49er tailgate before a game

Lol I see it lasting 5 minutes at a tg..then they get the cooler, clink beers and have a truce. End up hugging after getting drunk..cheering, "Let's go Niners!"

Originally posted by Memphis9er:
Does the team get the stat, or the qb?
According to the NFL stat section, there's no stat for qb wins. That kind of answers the question. Wins are a team function. No matter if your qb is Mahomes or Zack Wilson, they require the rest of the team to win. They can't do it alone.

Makes sense, especially if your qb is Jimmy g. I don't think I have ever seen him put a team on his back and win. Definitely a team stat.

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by GoreGoreGore:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by DonnieDarko:
Marino was awesome, his teams weren't

end of story

can lock thread now

DM SB record 0-1, He's def not successful

He ranks top 10 in QB wins and his percentage is better than Brees. Even looking only at wins.. which I don't recommend.. he's still highly successful.

like i said calling Jimmy successful is an opinion

Jimmy LIVES in your dome lol. He was talking about Dan Marino.

This isn't about Jimmy. I made that point to show that stats collectively tell the story, not by themselves individually. Jimmy being the 6th highest rated passer of all-time does not mean he's the 6th best or even close. Nor does wins. But W/L is still a QB stat no matter how you slice it. Per NFL.com too.

where on NFL.com ?

Page 302
https://operations.nfl.com/media/6101/2022-record-and-fact-book.pdf

This is https://www.nfl.com/

not some fun facts and learn about football, you should print that out and grab some crayons lol

It's the official NFL record book. I don't see QBR though. Weird.

Thats bc it's an ESPN stat lol.

So again, only stats that the NFL recognizes are real stats?

Why would someone else's stats be official NFL stats?

Heck , Jed has a win/loss record if you can find the right site

Stay on topic (for once). The discussion is whether QB W/L record is a QB stat. Various standards are being thrown out but the one I keep hearing is whether the NFL recognizes it. In the case of QB W/L records, the NFL does recognize it. So that should be the end of the discussion, right?

I actually don't necessarily agree with that, and think that stats like QBR, air yards, etc. are indeed "stats" even though the NFL doesn't recognize them. Again, no singular stat is the "be all end all" which is what it seems many are trying to argue here. They all can contribute to a discussion about a player.

As far as owners, what better way would you compare the success of owners to one another than by their W/L record, number of Super Bowls won, etc?

Stay on topic? You're the one stuck on QBR digression tactic this whole time and now you're at it again with this stats are not stats bs. I never said that.

Why would the nfl not add wins to their actual stats site if they they truly recognize it ? maybe they don't have someone who knows how to configure a website?

why make it downloadable and not just a regular site to view the entire info… because it's just fun kiddie stuff

Dude seriously? Go look how long that NFL record book is, it's like 900 pages. They can't fit that neatly on one page for each position. Terrible argument.

And YOU are the main person bringing up NFL com as the standard. Yet you cite QBR constantly when discussing QB play. That's hypocritical.
https://www.dictionary.com/browse/hypocritical

there you go lying and digressing again. i don't cite QBR for anything or do it constantly.. thats you keep bringing it up because you can't comprehend what i said.

So the perpetual growth on every player and new players stats won't be 900 pages long if you took all that info from the actual NFL.com stat site... I mean the same player and numbers are already on the NFL.com site?.. you think the NFL is unable to add a simple W/L record to the QB stats ? man you really don't know how sites and info work.

Do multiple people have access to your account? Only logical explanation I can think of for how often your argument changes and how different they are each time.

ah every time you lose, you start this crap.. lol

you really do have a comprehension issues.

Multiple people in this thread alone have commented how you constantly change your argument and avoid the topic. This time YOU created it and you still can't stay on it. YOU set the standard that NFL.com is where "real stats" are.

Is QBR not a stat, then? You have yet to answer.

You're also all over the place regarding the NFL record book. It's a coffee table book, a kid's book. Either the NFL is your standard or it isn't. You can't have it both ways.

It's only changed due to people like you bringing in other variables to digress and spin. Example, you keep bringing up QBR

As for books, you do know the meaning when some says it's a coffee book right? And since when a CT book can't be a kids book ?

as for standard, your failing to see the nfl doesn't doesn't care for fun facts as stat and doesn't need to place those fun facts on their stat website. Not one person goes to that fun fact site to get stats period

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by GoreGoreGore:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by 49erFaithful6:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by DonnieDarko:
Marino was awesome, his teams weren't

end of story

can lock thread now

DM SB record 0-1, He's def not successful

He ranks top 10 in QB wins and his percentage is better than Brees. Even looking only at wins.. which I don't recommend.. he's still highly successful.

like i said calling Jimmy successful is an opinion

Jimmy LIVES in your dome lol. He was talking about Dan Marino.

This isn't about Jimmy. I made that point to show that stats collectively tell the story, not by themselves individually. Jimmy being the 6th highest rated passer of all-time does not mean he's the 6th best or even close. Nor does wins. But W/L is still a QB stat no matter how you slice it. Per NFL.com too.

where on NFL.com ?

Page 302
https://operations.nfl.com/media/6101/2022-record-and-fact-book.pdf

This is https://www.nfl.com/

not some fun facts and learn about football, you should print that out and grab some crayons lol

It's the official NFL record book. I don't see QBR though. Weird.

Thats bc it's an ESPN stat lol.

So again, only stats that the NFL recognizes are real stats?

Why would someone else's stats be official NFL stats?

Heck , Jed has a win/loss record if you can find the right site

Stay on topic (for once). The discussion is whether QB W/L record is a QB stat. Various standards are being thrown out but the one I keep hearing is whether the NFL recognizes it. In the case of QB W/L records, the NFL does recognize it. So that should be the end of the discussion, right?

I actually don't necessarily agree with that, and think that stats like QBR, air yards, etc. are indeed "stats" even though the NFL doesn't recognize them. Again, no singular stat is the "be all end all" which is what it seems many are trying to argue here. They all can contribute to a discussion about a player.

As far as owners, what better way would you compare the success of owners to one another than by their W/L record, number of Super Bowls won, etc?

Stay on topic? You're the one stuck on QBR digression tactic this whole time and now you're at it again with this stats are not stats bs. I never said that.

Why would the nfl not add wins to their actual stats site if they they truly recognize it ? maybe they don't have someone who knows how to configure a website?

why make it downloadable and not just a regular site to view the entire info… because it's just fun kiddie stuff

Dude seriously? Go look how long that NFL record book is, it's like 900 pages. They can't fit that neatly on one page for each position. Terrible argument.

And YOU are the main person bringing up NFL com as the standard. Yet you cite QBR constantly when discussing QB play. That's hypocritical.
https://www.dictionary.com/browse/hypocritical

there you go lying and digressing again. i don't cite QBR for anything or do it constantly.. thats you keep bringing it up because you can't comprehend what i said.

So the perpetual growth on every player and new players stats won't be 900 pages long if you took all that info from the actual NFL.com stat site... I mean the same player and numbers are already on the NFL.com site?.. you think the NFL is unable to add a simple W/L record to the QB stats ? man you really don't know how sites and info work.

Do multiple people have access to your account? Only logical explanation I can think of for how often your argument changes and how different they are each time.

ah every time you lose, you start this crap.. lol

you really do have a comprehension issues.

Multiple people in this thread alone have commented how you constantly change your argument and avoid the topic. This time YOU created it and you still can't stay on it. YOU set the standard that NFL.com is where "real stats" are.

Is QBR not a stat, then? You have yet to answer.

You're also all over the place regarding the NFL record book. It's a coffee table book, a kid's book. Either the NFL is your standard or it isn't. You can't have it both ways.

It's only changed due to people like you bringing in other variables to digress and spin. Example, you keep bringing up QBR

As for books, you do know the meaning when some says it's a coffee book right? And since when a CT book can't be a kids book ?

as for standard, your failing to see the nfl doesn't doesn't care for fun facts as stat and doesn't need to place those fun facts on their stat website. Not one person goes to that fun fact site to get stats period

"Other variables" are necessary to point out your hypocritical argument. You say QB W/L record can't be considered a stat because it's not on NFL.com (even though the NFL clearly recognizes it as an official stat). Yet you consider QBR a stat, even though it's not on NFL.com nor does the NFL recognize it as a stat.

You're essentially saying that your opinion is the standard by which something can or can't be considered a stat lol.

Originally posted by Bringbackedjr:

Originally posted by Memphis9er:
Does the team get the stat, or the qb?
According to the NFL stat section, there's no stat for qb wins. That kind of answers the question. Wins are a team function. No matter if your qb is Mahomes or Zack Wilson, they require the rest of the team to win. They can't do it alone.

Makes sense, especially if your qb is Jimmy g. I don't think I have ever seen him put a team on his back and win. Definitely a team stat.

Except the NFL records QB W/L record (as a starter for Random) and has it in it's record book. Just because they don't squeeze it on the main page of stats, doesn't mean it's not there. There are a ton of stats that aren't on that main page.

And for anyone saying that NFL.com stat section is the standard - does that mean that QBR is not a stat? Or air yards? Or any of the efficiency stats that NextGen puts out? Are we going to stop using ALL of those stats and ONLY use what's on NFL.com to discuss QB play?

Sure, I'll play along. Jimmy Garoppolo has the 6th highest passer rating of all-time. Therefore he is a top 10 QB of all-time.

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by Bringbackedjr:

Originally posted by Memphis9er:
Does the team get the stat, or the qb?
According to the NFL stat section, there's no stat for qb wins. That kind of answers the question. Wins are a team function. No matter if your qb is Mahomes or Zack Wilson, they require the rest of the team to win. They can't do it alone.

Makes sense, especially if your qb is Jimmy g. I don't think I have ever seen him put a team on his back and win. Definitely a team stat.

Except the NFL records QB W/L record (as a starter for Random) and has it in it's record book. Just because they don't squeeze it on the main page of stats, doesn't mean it's not there. There are a ton of stats that aren't on that main page.

And for anyone saying that NFL.com stat section is the standard - does that mean that QBR is not a stat? Or air yards? Or any of the efficiency stats that NextGen puts out? Are we going to stop using ALL of those stats and ONLY use what's on NFL.com to discuss QB play?

Sure, I'll play along. Jimmy Garoppolo has the 6th highest passer rating of all-time. Therefore he is a top 10 QB of all-time.

Stat geeks are always inventing new stats to rank or rate players. For QBs we had completion percentage and TDs. That wasn't enough so they invented passer rating. Then someone decided that wasn't good enough so they developed QBR. W/L record could be applied to any player. A WR or a left tackle. How about an edge rusher.

There are a few QBs that are so talented that they can make big plays when really needed but not many. Brock isn't in that category but he's one of those guys that lifts everyone around him. Receivers are spotted when they get open so they get more catches. The occasional run for a 1st down when it looks like he'll be sacked. Knowing where his safety net is and being able to locate that RB drifting out in the flat while he's getting chased. All the little things that together make a big difference. Eventually all those little things build an air of confidence throughout the entire team. The players begin to feel like n matter what happens they will be able to overcome it.

Tom Brady should be EXTREMELY PROUD of his career record as a starter in the NFL. But....

...Tom Brady didn't win 251 games. His teams did. Great accomplishment nonetheless when you factor everything else in.

Originally posted by CatchMaster80:

Originally posted by Furlow:

Originally posted by Bringbackedjr:

Originally posted by Memphis9er:
Does the team get the stat, or the qb?
According to the NFL stat section, there's no stat for qb wins. That kind of answers the question. Wins are a team function. No matter if your qb is Mahomes or Zack Wilson, they require the rest of the team to win. They can't do it alone.

Makes sense, especially if your qb is Jimmy g. I don't think I have ever seen him put a team on his back and win. Definitely a team stat.

Except the NFL records QB W/L record (as a starter for Random) and has it in it's record book. Just because they don't squeeze it on the main page of stats, doesn't mean it's not there. There are a ton of stats that aren't on that main page.

And for anyone saying that NFL.com stat section is the standard - does that mean that QBR is not a stat? Or air yards? Or any of the efficiency stats that NextGen puts out? Are we going to stop using ALL of those stats and ONLY use what's on NFL.com to discuss QB play?

Sure, I'll play along. Jimmy Garoppolo has the 6th highest passer rating of all-time. Therefore he is a top 10 QB of all-time.

Stat geeks are always inventing new stats to rank or rate players. For QBs we had completion percentage and TDs. That wasn't enough so they invented passer rating. Then someone decided that wasn't good enough so they developed QBR. W/L record could be applied to any player. A WR or a left tackle. How about an edge rusher.

There are a few QBs that are so talented that they can make big plays when really needed but not many. Brock isn't in that category but he's one of those guys that lifts everyone around him. Receivers are spotted when they get open so they get more catches. The occasional run for a 1st down when it looks like he'll be sacked. Knowing where his safety net is and being able to locate that RB drifting out in the flat while he's getting chased. All the little things that together make a big difference. Eventually all those little things build an air of confidence throughout the entire team. The players begin to feel like n matter what happens they will be able to overcome it.

W/L could be applied to any player, but it's not. Likely because of the fact that no single player contributes more towards winning or losing that the QB. So W/L is not recorded for other players, only QB's.

I and many others have repeatedly said that it's perfectly fair to discuss the merits of W/L record when discussing how good a particular QB is. But denying that W/L record is a QB stat is intellectually dishonest.

Why do people have such a big problem with reality?

Originally posted by random49er:


Tom Brady should be EXTREMELY PROUD of his career record as a starter in the NFL. But....

...Tom Brady didn't win 251 games. His teams did. Great accomplishment nonetheless when you factor everything else in.

Originally posted by random49er:
Why do people have such a big problem with reality?

Why do people continue to interpret QB W/L record as "the quarterback and only the quarterback won the game?"

Winning record--yes

Losing record--no

Using StatMuse to make your argument

It literally answers the question in the manner in which you search:

"Tom Brady has the most career wins by a quarterback, with 251 wins."
https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask?q=most+qb+wins+all-time