OTC's Causal Analysis: Why We Suck & Who's to Blame

Originally posted by JaggedJ:
Good read OTC. Not going to put it into percentages, but for me the clear issues are.

ST - No explanation needed really. They're just bad. Part is coaching, part a lack of depth and injuries further eroding that depth, but it's poorly coached.

D - Sorenson is not the guy, again injuries haven't been kind, but we look like we're throwing out guys with instructions to "go win". No creativity, no disguises, the opposition pretty much know what they're up against, it's just a matter of whether or not they can exploit it.

O - Our OL, especially C is killing us. Needs a revamp or we'll have more of the same next year. Deebo's time is done imo. Not a good enough receiver, and the gadget plays don't work.

Scheme - Everything looks difficult at the moment, and the opposition seems to know what we're doing on both sides of the ball. Need to evolve, but not wipe the slate clean to the point where we're not utilising the talent we have properly.

Key off season moves
- New DC and ST coach. Get an experienced DC who has a proven system that fits the players we have.

- See what we can get for Deebo. I would take a 2nd and 5th even with losing 15mil in cap space as long as it doesn't prevent us from keeping Greenlaw.

- Revamp the OL. I know, I know, we say this every year and it doesn't happen.

- We need to repeat last year's draft success. Easier said than done, but if we can get younger and cheaper without a drop off then it will open our window.

Key outs
Deebo, Hufanga, Ward, Brendel, Banks, Hargraves it depends, can't get rid of everyone and just rely on draft picks to fill all holes.

Key needs in draft and FA
C, LG, CB, T, FS, DE/DT (dependent on other moves).

Must re-sign
Greenlaw. Keep all restricted FA.

Ya.....give me a better OL, fire St and defensive coaches and go get a linebacker.

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by mcwoot:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by Cisco0623:
I dont blame Brock nearly as much as you do.

I love Brock, I just think his mistakes have been magnified this year due to games being closer and us not having the defense or special teams to close these ones out. I still believe he can be an elite QB, but he needs better protection and just needs to find ways to cut down on some of those turnovers.

He was definitely shellshocked earlier in the season. He is sailing a lot of throw this year and I don't know if he's not setting his feet, has an injury, is in his own head, or some combination.

Jonny touched on this and said its a footwork mechanics issue with his from leg.

It's on Brock, and Griese, and so forth to fix it then.

But, it also has to be on the o line. These defenses are so fast and athletic and the schemes so high level that it's hard to find great offensive line play much of anywhere. But I can only imagine that when you start to feel like you don't have enough time to throw, that's probably the number one cause, or close to it, for why a quarterback's mechanics and footwork gets messed up. Sometimes it works out but this starting an undrafted center and taking an iffy guy in the 5th round I believe in McKivitz who was pretty much just depth that we're now starting hurts. Again I don't get to watch but people have complained about Banks and even big Trent is having a tougher time as age and injuries seem to be catching up to him. You can't have a young, physically limited quarterback back there that you're throwing to the wolves, no matter how bright he is, because you won't go out and get the guys either free agency or draft to protect him.

Originally posted by Kolohe:
Sorry OTC I didn't read your post just responding to the title. BUT, IMO the reason why the 49ers suck, Shanahan/Foerster won't make changes to the O-line, mainly at Center. No misdirection plays anymore. Sorensen sucks, this defense got their balls snipped. Instead of an attacking defense Sorensen mentioned when he was first hired, we get a "hope we don't f**k up" defense. They refused to spend money on a veteran Safety, Mustapha, Odum and Brown's inexperience has showed this season.

Wide-9 is wack, teams expose the s**t out of it by just running the ball down the defenses throat, not to mention DeVondre Campbell isn't helping the cause either. Shanahan's over use of one RB, mix s**t up like Detroit does and how you use to back in 2019 with Raheem Mostert and Tevin Coleman. In the end, Brock Purdy needs better protection, all the top QB's in the league have a solid Center.

Am I crazy for agreeing with everything you wrote here and still wanting Shanahan fired?

Brendel is a great example of why Kyle?? Why do they insist on putting him out there?

Justin Simmons sat in FA forever. I don't understand why we didn't sign him. Very Poor decision by Lynch.

Originally posted by Kolohe:

Originally posted by mitpdub:
Some of those Purdy percentage blames need to be on Kyle and Lynch. Purdy executes the plays called to him. The TDS last week were because of his extra effort, just like he did during summer of our wins this year and last years playoffs.
He has open blitzers, failed blocks and he's running for his life. That's the scheme and the personnel.

Purdy does tend to hold onto the ball too f**kin long.

Live by it and die by it......

I am not going to trash the org.... because what they have done, made sense in the moment......

but

WE have a very clear look at what our future is going to be.......

We have a drop back QB, that had a rare ability to look down field and roll the dice and win more downs then he looses. There have been gamblers in the past, but only the truly GREAT ones work in the NFL

The 49ers have a great one

Personally I would probably tend to be wayyyy more critical of the front office in the future ... if they do not shift the roster to account for what Purdy is.

The blue print is CLEAR AS DAY......build up the damn line, give Purdy time to find the open guys when they beak free 15-20 yards down field and lets gooooo.

Shanny and company can work on Brock's internal clock, and build out YAC stuff underneath to keep other defenses honest...but you sure as s**t...do not....nerf your QB, when you got one with a rare combination of ability and conviction to go for the jugular on the regular.

The 49ers have the unicorn...they have that 30-40 point per game QB....just build around the dude.

Mason shouldn't even be on that list. He was a top 5 rusher before the bye week. That's incredible value for an undrafted player.

Originally posted by TD49ers:

Originally posted by JaggedJ:
Good read OTC. Not going to put it into percentages, but for me the clear issues are.

ST - No explanation needed really. They're just bad. Part is coaching, part a lack of depth and injuries further eroding that depth, but it's poorly coached.

D - Sorenson is not the guy, again injuries haven't been kind, but we look like we're throwing out guys with instructions to "go win". No creativity, no disguises, the opposition pretty much know what they're up against, it's just a matter of whether or not they can exploit it.

O - Our OL, especially C is killing us. Needs a revamp or we'll have more of the same next year. Deebo's time is done imo. Not a good enough receiver, and the gadget plays don't work.

Scheme - Everything looks difficult at the moment, and the opposition seems to know what we're doing on both sides of the ball. Need to evolve, but not wipe the slate clean to the point where we're not utilising the talent we have properly.

Key off season moves
- New DC and ST coach. Get an experienced DC who has a proven system that fits the players we have.

- See what we can get for Deebo. I would take a 2nd and 5th even with losing 15mil in cap space as long as it doesn't prevent us from keeping Greenlaw.

- Revamp the OL. I know, I know, we say this every year and it doesn't happen.

- We need to repeat last year's draft success. Easier said than done, but if we can get younger and cheaper without a drop off then it will open our window.

Key outs
Deebo, Hufanga, Ward, Brendel, Banks, Hargraves it depends, can't get rid of everyone and just rely on draft picks to fill all holes.

Key needs in draft and FA
C, LG, CB, T, FS, DE/DT (dependent on other moves).

Must re-sign
Greenlaw. Keep all restricted FA.

Ya.....give me a better OL, fire St and defensive coaches and go get a linebacker.

If we re-sign Greenlaw like we should then LB is less of a priority, but agree we need that 3rd guy who can contribute but also step in if there's an injury.

No more vet min guys who are passed it but expected to be starters because experience.

Our defensive scheme is outdated

Shanahans blame goes beyond game management. Brock is dealing with poor oline play and free rushers weekly, teams have realized his scheme eats against Zone so they aren't playing Zone. Kyle has yet to effectively adjust his scheme/ playcalling. Brock hasn't had time to get through reads this year like he has in years past, he's being forced out of the pocket more and more.
Any blame placed on Brock is at least 50% understandable IMHO.

Originally posted by sick9erfan:
Shanahans blame goes beyond game management. Brock is dealing with poor oline play and free rushers weekly, teams have realized his scheme eats against Zone so they aren't playing Zone. Kyle has yet to effectively adjust his scheme/ playcalling. Brock hasn't had time to get through reads this year like he has in years past, he's being forced out of the pocket more and more.
Any blame placed on Brock is at least 50% understandable IMHO.

Brock isn't the one calling sweep plays to a horribly out of shape Deebo when we have several players better suited for those plays.

Its the old Chicken or Egg discussion? You think its the chicken I think its the egg, there really isn't a way to know for sure.

Originally posted by JaggedJ:

Good read OTC. Not going to put it into percentages, but for me the clear issues are.

ST - No explanation needed really. They're just bad. Part is coaching, part a lack of depth and injuries further eroding that depth, but it's poorly coached.

D - Sorenson is not the guy, again injuries haven't been kind, but we look like we're throwing out guys with instructions to "go win". No creativity, no disguises, the opposition pretty much know what they're up against, it's just a matter of whether or not they can exploit it.

O - Our OL, especially C is killing us. Needs a revamp or we'll have more of the same next year. Deebo's time is done imo. Not a good enough receiver, and the gadget plays don't work.

Scheme - Everything looks difficult at the moment, and the opposition seems to know what we're doing on both sides of the ball. Need to evolve, but not wipe the slate clean to the point where we're not utilising the talent we have properly.

Key off season moves
- New DC and ST coach. Get an experienced DC who has a proven system that fits the players we have.

- See what we can get for Deebo. I would take a 2nd and 5th even with losing 15mil in cap space as long as it doesn't prevent us from keeping Greenlaw.

- Revamp the OL. I know, I know, we say this every year and it doesn't happen.

- We need to repeat last year's draft success. Easier said than done, but if we can get younger and cheaper without a drop off then it will open our window.

Key outs
Deebo, Hufanga, Ward, Brendel, Banks, Hargraves it depends, can't get rid of everyone and just rely on draft picks to fill all holes.

Key needs in draft and FA
C, LG, CB, T, FS, DE/DT (dependent on other moves).

Must re-sign
Greenlaw. Keep all restricted FA.

Great summary, thanks! Completely agree with everything here.

great write up. I too believe letting Kyle go would be a huge mistake. He deserves a chance to get this going in the right direction this off season. Lynch is also part of that team, they exist so well together, some teams don't find that. With Sorenson, I'd say, you better have a plan and a backup plan if you dump him. Have somebody available and desirable, I think there was no plan after Wilkes was fired. Let that person use their own system and bring his own guys if he needs to.
We have a personnel issue. Missed on 7 of 9 first rounders for example. We have no speed, no depth; thankfully we hit on the last draft, and we can build on that.
I love our coach, but this is his mess, it's his show. I hope he has the self awareness and humility to use the off season and take a look what has gone sideways and adapt and change. I think Kyle is set in his ways, Mcvay admitted that he was a few years ago and decided to let go a bit and I think it has benefited him and it would Kyle too.

Originally posted by PatandBow:

Excellent write up. I read it all. Definitely agree about Lynch. Thanks for the time that you put in to write this.

Appreciate the kind words. I believe we can fix things here and remain contenders with Kyle.

The dude took over the dumpster fire in 2017 and managed to get our offense ranked #12 with Hoyer, Carlos Hyde, Aldrick Robinson, Trent Taylor, and other garbage players.

That's my expectation for the ST and defensive units. Idc what the personnel is. We shouldn't be ranked last or bottom five if those coaches were any good. We've had to pick from the scrap heap because of our success.. Coaching staff gutted after championship or Super Bowl runs and then no one good is leftover.

Kyle has proven he will replace an under performing coach. He needs to do it again after this season. At minimum Schneider and Sorensen, but I'd see if we can upgrade over Forester too honestly.

Originally posted by BP13:

great write up. I too believe letting Kyle go would be a huge mistake. He deserves a chance to get this going in the right direction this off season. Lynch is also part of that team, they exist so well together, some teams don't find that. With Sorenson, I'd say, you better have a plan and a backup plan if you dump him. Have somebody available and desirable, I think there was no plan after Wilkes was fired. Let that person use their own system and bring his own guys if he needs to.
We have a personnel issue. Missed on 7 of 9 first rounders for example. We have no speed, no depth; thankfully we hit on the last draft, and we can build on that.
I love our coach, but this is his mess, it's his show. I hope he has the self awareness and humility to use the off season and take a look what has gone sideways and adapt and change. I think Kyle is set in his ways, Mcvay admitted that he was a few years ago and decided to let go a bit and I think it has benefited him and it would Kyle too.

You know, I think Kyle is realizing a little bit that he has to adapt, he's just been a bit slower to make big changes. Maybe reluctant mid-season, I don't know. Could be good reason for that, but I hope he comes into next year with some fresh concepts. He's certainly capable. I mean the dude figured out how to destroy Seattle's legion of boom. He's bound to figure out whatever the next scheme fad there is.

If folks can figure out him, he can figure out them.

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by BP13:
great write up. I too believe letting Kyle go would be a huge mistake. He deserves a chance to get this going in the right direction this off season. Lynch is also part of that team, they exist so well together, some teams don't find that. With Sorenson, I'd say, you better have a plan and a backup plan if you dump him. Have somebody available and desirable, I think there was no plan after Wilkes was fired. Let that person use their own system and bring his own guys if he needs to.
We have a personnel issue. Missed on 7 of 9 first rounders for example. We have no speed, no depth; thankfully we hit on the last draft, and we can build on that.
I love our coach, but this is his mess, it's his show. I hope he has the self awareness and humility to use the off season and take a look what has gone sideways and adapt and change. I think Kyle is set in his ways, Mcvay admitted that he was a few years ago and decided to let go a bit and I think it has benefited him and it would Kyle too.

You know, I think Kyle is realizing a little bit that he has to adapt, he's just been a bit slower to make big changes. Maybe reluctant mid-season, I don't know. Could be good reason for that, but I hope he comes into next year with some fresh concepts. He's certainly capable. I mean the dude figured out how to destroy Seattle's legion of boom. He's bound to figure out whatever the next scheme fad there is.

If folks can figure out him, he can figure out them.

has to adapt, you mean play backyard ball? We don't have the right QB to do that.

Dude has a machine of a scheme, but it all depends on the QB and how fast the QB can get to the next progression in time.