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The San Francisco Giants Thread

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
You forgot the part where I said, "if they get 3 great years from him AND he helps them win 1-2 more titles"....I think most would agree that the Giants won in spite of Zito with that one glaring exception (2012 post season). Guys like Greinke, Price, etc., are apples to Zito's orange in that respect, don't you think?


Looking back, yes. We all have 20/20.

But Greinke, Price, etc...do they come with any better pedigree than Zito when he signed with the Giants? I'll submit that Zito (age 27 when he signed with the Giants, right?) was one of the top free agent pitchers in baseball when the Giants signed him. Why wouldn't the expectation have been that Zito give the Giants 3 great years?

Just like Greinke, Price, etc....

So yeah, who knows. Buyer beware.
Blanco!
Originally posted by reno9er:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
You forgot the part where I said, "if they get 3 great years from him AND he helps them win 1-2 more titles"....I think most would agree that the Giants won in spite of Zito with that one glaring exception (2012 post season). Guys like Greinke, Price, etc., are apples to Zito's orange in that respect, don't you think?


Looking back, yes. We all have 20/20.

But Greinke, Price, etc...do they come with any better pedigree than Zito when he signed with the Giants? I'll submit that Zito (age 27 when he signed with the Giants, right?) was one of the top free agent pitchers in baseball when the Giants signed him. Why wouldn't the expectation have been that Zito give the Giants 3 great years?

Just like Greinke, Price, etc....

So yeah, who knows. Buyer beware.

Price and Greinke come with much better pedigrees than Zito had when the Giants stupidly paid him a fortune. Zito's K rate was declining rapidly and the year before in Oakland he struck out only 150 batters in 221 innings. Plus, his era the previous 3 years was 3.83 3.86 and 4.48. Hardly dominate numbers. Reality was that they paid Zito for one big year and because he never missed a turn.

Zito isnt in the same universe as a pitcher that Greinke and Price are.
Originally posted by reno9er:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
You forgot the part where I said, "if they get 3 great years from him AND he helps them win 1-2 more titles"....I think most would agree that the Giants won in spite of Zito with that one glaring exception (2012 post season). Guys like Greinke, Price, etc., are apples to Zito's orange in that respect, don't you think?


Looking back, yes. We all have 20/20.

But Greinke, Price, etc...do they come with any better pedigree than Zito when he signed with the Giants? I'll submit that Zito (age 27 when he signed with the Giants, right?) was one of the top free agent pitchers in baseball when the Giants signed him. Why wouldn't the expectation have been that Zito give the Giants 3 great years?

Just like Greinke, Price, etc....

So yeah, who knows. Buyer beware.

I can only say that Zito never had the kind of stuff Greinke, Price, Zimmerman, etc., had. Never, not even at the start of his career, much less when his stuff was in decline and we stupidly overpaid for him (many of us said that even at the time). That's not 20/20 hindsight at all...he never should've been given that kind of deal and nobody else would've if we didn't. These things were being said at the time, not just now.

Buyer beware, absolutely, but there really isn't any comparison to Zito and the guys we're talking about now.
Originally posted by Ninerjohn:
Originally posted by reno9er:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
You forgot the part where I said, "if they get 3 great years from him AND he helps them win 1-2 more titles"....I think most would agree that the Giants won in spite of Zito with that one glaring exception (2012 post season). Guys like Greinke, Price, etc., are apples to Zito's orange in that respect, don't you think?


Looking back, yes. We all have 20/20.

But Greinke, Price, etc...do they come with any better pedigree than Zito when he signed with the Giants? I'll submit that Zito (age 27 when he signed with the Giants, right?) was one of the top free agent pitchers in baseball when the Giants signed him. Why wouldn't the expectation have been that Zito give the Giants 3 great years?

Just like Greinke, Price, etc....

So yeah, who knows. Buyer beware.

Price and Greinke come with much better pedigrees than Zito had when the Giants stupidly paid him a fortune. Zito's K rate was declining rapidly and the year before in Oakland he struck out only 150 batters in 221 innings. Plus, his era the previous 3 years was 3.83 3.86 and 4.48. Hardly dominate numbers. Reality was that they paid Zito for one big year and because he never missed a turn.

Zito isnt in the same universe as a pitcher that Greinke and Price are.

All of this.
Originally posted by Ninerjohn:
Price and Greinke come with much better pedigrees than Zito had when the Giants stupidly paid him a fortune. Zito's K rate was declining rapidly and the year before in Oakland he struck out only 150 batters in 221 innings. Plus, his era the previous 3 years was 3.83 3.86 and 4.48. Hardly dominate numbers. Reality was that they paid Zito for one big year and because he never missed a turn.

Zito isnt in the same universe as a pitcher that Greinke and Price are.

Maybe you misread...I didn't say he was. Look again if you need to figure it out. That was exactly my point

Was he in the same universe as Jason Schmidt when the Dodgers signed him? How old was Schmidt when he signed with the Dodgers?
fkn hudson
Originally posted by reno9er:
Originally posted by Ninerjohn:
Price and Greinke come with much better pedigrees than Zito had when the Giants stupidly paid him a fortune. Zito's K rate was declining rapidly and the year before in Oakland he struck out only 150 batters in 221 innings. Plus, his era the previous 3 years was 3.83 3.86 and 4.48. Hardly dominate numbers. Reality was that they paid Zito for one big year and because he never missed a turn.

Zito isnt in the same universe as a pitcher that Greinke and Price are.

Maybe you misread...I didn't say he was. Look again if you need to figure it out. That was exactly my point

Was he in the same universe as Jason Schmidt when the Dodgers signed him? How old was Schmidt when he signed with the Dodgers?

You asked if Zito came with the same pedigree and I answered your question. NO he didnt and not even close.
Travis Iskikawa 3-4 with a HR and 4 RBI. Nice to see.
Originally posted by reno9er:
Originally posted by Ninerjohn:
Price and Greinke come with much better pedigrees than Zito had when the Giants stupidly paid him a fortune. Zito's K rate was declining rapidly and the year before in Oakland he struck out only 150 batters in 221 innings. Plus, his era the previous 3 years was 3.83 3.86 and 4.48. Hardly dominate numbers. Reality was that they paid Zito for one big year and because he never missed a turn.

Zito isnt in the same universe as a pitcher that Greinke and Price are.

Maybe you misread...I didn't say he was. Look again if you need to figure it out. That was exactly my point

Was he in the same universe as Jason Schmidt when the Dodgers signed him? How old was Schmidt when he signed with the Dodgers?

Schmidt's career was derailed because of injuries, not mediocre performance like Zito. Yes, there's risk in every free agent signing and even more so with SPs given their cost/frailty, but it's the price of doing business when you're chasing titles don't you think?
Pagan in CF.

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Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Pagan in CF.


Originally posted by reno9er:
Originally posted by Ninerjohn:
Ken Rosenthal article.......

GREINKE'S NEXT TEAM: THEGIANTS?

If any team is the favorite to awardZack Greinke his next contract, it's the Dodgers. Greinke in fact, might only opt out of his deal at the end of the season to negotiate a higher guarantee with management, which currently owes him $71 million over the next three years.

Then again, Greinke turns 32 on Oct. 21 — and even though he is precisely the type of pitcher who should age well, the data-driven Dodgers might be reluctant to splurge on him.

In which case, why not the Giants?

Nearly $50 million is coming off the Giants' payroll at the end of the season, if you combine the salaries of Tim Lincecum, Tim Hudson, Marco Scutaro,Jeremy Affeldt, Ryan Vogelsong and Casey McGehee.

The Giants might want to retain one or two of those players, but they should have plenty of flexibility, even with other salaries rising. Greinke surely will want to remain with a competitive team. With the Giants, as with the Dodgers, he could operate in the shadow of an ace, though Madison Bumgarner is notClayton Kershaw.

One other thing: Greinke recently told USA Today that he admired the Giants players and couldn't decide whether to root for San Francisco or his original team, Kansas City, in last year's World Series.


The ultimate sucker move. Some team is going to lay out $25 million + per year for this guy for about 6 years until he's 38.

Remember Jason Schmidt? He helped drive the Dodgers into bankruptcy, another pitcher who would supposedly "age well". That would be their ultimate revenge on the Giants to have them bite on Greinke.

Don't see it happening.

Who thought Schmidt would age well? He was having shoulder problems during his prime...
Originally posted by Rubberneck36:
I would like Price. Younger, made a career of facing a tough hitting league. Dominant lefty. I'd take Greinke also of course.

Price is younger, but Greinke is simply a better pitcher. Greinke won a CY in the American League as well.

If im shelling out big bucks, Greinke is the safer bet. Plus its not only adding an ace to our staff, but removing one from the Dodgers.
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